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Thread: Epic Rules

  1. #1
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    Epic Rules

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    Wasn't there a published book with Alternate Epic rules as to the Epic Level Handbook and the 3.5 DMG?

    Thanks.
    Bill
    The Yeti aka Magnus the Archmage
    ~"Henry Bowman lives within each and everyone of us, and it's time to start acting like it. "
    A Story Hour set in Valus by Funeris
    http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=97346
    My SH Set in Valus 20yrs after Funeris's Valus SH
    http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=133211
    Bryon_Soulweaver - "Stupid nobles, hope Mangus blasts them (and I woundn't doubt if he could)."
    Funeris's 2nd SH(he isDM)
    http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=130328

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    If there was, I'd like to see it. I didn't favor some of the spell goings-on in that book.

  3. #3
    Ed Zachary Guest
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    The epic feats for Fighters sucked.

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    I dunno... perfect two weapon fighting is pretty nasty...

  5. #5
    Ed Zachary Guest
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    Quote Originally Posted by RealmsDM View Post
    I dunno... perfect two weapon fighting is pretty nasty...
    Some of the feats are good, but the prerequisites make them absolutly useless.

    Do you have your 25 Dexterity to use that?

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    Stuff like that would make you OCD and have to design a spreadsheet to plan your character's every step.

  7. #7
    Ed Zachary Guest
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moritz View Post
    Stuff like that would make you OCD and have to design a spreadsheet to plan your character's every step.
    Exactly... better start working on that Dex at first level!

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    Here's the thread I posted on EnWorld about it as well, for anyone that wanted their suggestions.

    http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=203473

    I might look into a few of them.
    Mainly we are looking at where we want to go from here deal.
    We are playing in Dawnforge (Fantasy Flight Games) and are all 15th/16th level currently. The stage of the campaign is at a 'good' wrap up point if we decided to do that in the next couple of sessions. Its mainly a question if we want to go forward into Epicness or not. So was going to check out possible alternatives for the rules.
    Bill
    The Yeti aka Magnus the Archmage
    ~"Henry Bowman lives within each and everyone of us, and it's time to start acting like it. "
    A Story Hour set in Valus by Funeris
    http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=97346
    My SH Set in Valus 20yrs after Funeris's Valus SH
    http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=133211
    Bryon_Soulweaver - "Stupid nobles, hope Mangus blasts them (and I woundn't doubt if he could)."
    Funeris's 2nd SH(he isDM)
    http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=130328

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    yea, the prereq's are a bit out there, but hey, its still a cool feat. It's possible to hit the 25 mark in a ability at high level, but I usually let players take it as long as they have a 20+ Dex, and they can "sell me" on why their PC deserves it (in character of course- buying the DM nachos & beer has no bearing on in game decissions)

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    I believe if you have an enhancement item that bumps you up to the required number, you qualify for the feat. You just can't use the feat without your item. If you have the 19 dex required for greater two weapon and +6 gloves, you have your 25.
    But the epic fighter feats do suck compared to the epic arcane and divine feats.

  11. #11
    Ed Zachary Guest
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    Quote Originally Posted by starfalconkd View Post
    I believe if you have an enhancement item that bumps you up to the required number, you qualify for the feat. You just can't use the feat without your item. If you have the 19 dex required for greater two weapon and +6 gloves, you have your 25.
    But the epic fighter feats do suck compared to the epic arcane and divine feats.
    Either that or the DM can make a house rule that modifies ridiculous prerequisites.

    If not the only characters that will have that feat are those that were created high level on the spot without ever being played.

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    I was under the impression that you had to have the BASE number up that high to qualify. That things which gave you stat bumps did not count.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Moritz View Post
    I was under the impression that you had to have the BASE number up that high to qualify. That things which gave you stat bumps did not count.
    Depends on your interpetation.

    Some include Inherant bonus, such as those gained via the various Books.
    Some will let things like Domain Powers count.

    Generally I do not let Magic Items count unless they are like the books where they are used up and then permanent afterwards.
    Otherwise you could take a Potion, level up, take the feat, then just take a potion everytime you wanted to use the feat.
    Bill
    The Yeti aka Magnus the Archmage
    ~"Henry Bowman lives within each and everyone of us, and it's time to start acting like it. "
    A Story Hour set in Valus by Funeris
    http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=97346
    My SH Set in Valus 20yrs after Funeris's Valus SH
    http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=133211
    Bryon_Soulweaver - "Stupid nobles, hope Mangus blasts them (and I woundn't doubt if he could)."
    Funeris's 2nd SH(he isDM)
    http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=130328

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheYeti1775 View Post
    Otherwise you could take a Potion, level up, take the feat, then just take a potion everytime you wanted to use the feat.
    This smacks of the "leveling eq" from the MUDs of the 90's... Such a broken system.

    I tend to use an "if you can take it off, it doesn't count" approach to bonus stacking for prereq purposes. Inherent bonuses, yes. Bonuses from worn items or potions, no.

    But, I really don't think that Dex 25 is too bad of a prereq. Think about it: a character begins with Dex 15 at 1st level, adds +1 at 4th, 8th, 12th, 16th & 20th levels (now 20), and makes some wishes for +5 inherent bonus (now 25). This is not really inconceivable or even improbable for a Dexterity-focused character.

    But what about a character not focused on Dexterity?

    Let's first remember that these Epic rules are meant for an infinite amount of upward scalability; the levels just keep going up. So what if you can't qualify for Perfect Two Weapon Fighting at 21st level? Maybe you can qualify at 24th, 28th or 32nd level. All you need to do is keep an eye on what feats you're taking on the way there.

    The Great [Ability score] feats each add 1 to an ability score. Not as an inherent bonus, not as an Epic bonus, they just add 1. With the amount of bonus feats that get thrown at your characters at Epic levels, you should be able to take enough Great [Something] feats to qualify for most things you'd want to take.

    But that's definitely taking the long view of things and delaying the instant gratification that comes with gaining a level and taking a "kewl" new feat. I can definitely delay my own gratification, usually because I can see the benefit of whatever cool rules item I want to take later on outweighs my temporary desire to want to do something cool now.
    Your pal,

    Adam Bomb

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    And in the case of the fighter, look at how awesome his feats (in number and kind) have been up to 20th level. If they fall off a little at Epic levels...meh. But I agree, the pre-req's are doable if you have been a two-weapon fighter all along and focused on bettering that ability.

    I do allow items (amulets, gloves, etc) to count towards those pre-reqs, because they are semi-permanent. My players know that those bonuses could be lost to them permanently or temporarily, depending on the situation. So if they want to rely on an item to give them an Epic feat when that item could be dispelled/disintegrated/damaged on a saving throw of 1/etc, then I am fine with that.

    Having said that, I have only had one group break into Epic, and we are only in the 21st/22nd level area.

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