Expensive Games $$$

[Tamburlain]

That's right, friends. This is a thread to kvetch about games that you want, but aren't likely to get (at least any time soon), because they simply cost too many bones.

For example...

Pendragon and Nobilis are two games I've always wanted to play, but can never find any group actually playing them. Nobilis has mixed-to-positive reviews and looks intriguing, because of the high-quality artwork fronted on the rule book. For Pendragon it is equally hard to find a group running it, despite the fact that it generally has lots of popular positive support and good reviews online. So, someone's playing it somewhere, just nowhere near me.

I chalk this up partly to the fact that both, especially Nobilis, are pretty expensive. This frustrates me for obvious reasons. I mean, did they release a small print run just to drive up the price? Were they unexpectedly popular? Or, like the KISS comic books from days of yore, are they printed in the blood of their creators? What the heck? These days Nobilis is currently priced anywhere between $150 to $200 --and can only be found online. For a new unused copy, Pendragon's latest core edition will run you between $30 to $40, which, by way of comparison, is high-to-standard for other new White Wolf or WotC hardcover releases. BUT, the Pendragon campaign book runs upwards of $200! Seems ridiculous. Who has that kind of scratch to drop on games?

Anyhoo, for anyone who plays Pendragon or Nobilis and frequents the the PaPG forums, I'd like know more about how the system compares to, say, Ars Magica, etc. Is the White Wolf version the best? Why the heck is it so expensive do you think?

[templeorder]

Gaming is NOT a cheap habit, thats for sure!!! I used to feel like a junkie, but... i can go for a few days now without cracking open a game book. Every day i'm getting better.

Really, its all publishing and distribution costs. Supply and Demand.. plus whatever they think is a good profit margin - if not based on volume then on "quality".

[Webhead]

Arkham Horror and it's (several) expansions:

Arkham Horror - $59.95
-The Dunwich Horror - $49.95
-Curse of the Dark Pharoh - $24.95
-The King In Yellow - $24.95
-Kingsport Horror - $49.95
-Black Goat of the Woods - $24.95
-Innsmouth Horror - $49.95

Grand total: $284.65 plus tax

[korhal23]

Some games are just expensive. I have to be EXTREMELY enamored by the system to drop any more than 30$ on a book. I can put your setting in any game, so it comes down to the mechanics. Spycraft I recommend all over the place, and even though the hardcover is 50$ (softcover is more like 20-30 i believe), I love the system and with over 500 pages there's a TON of information you're getting, plus the extra books tend to be 5$ or less. Aces and Eights was also a steep asking price for the main book (I believe it also weighed in around 50$) but as a huge simulationist, wild west fan, and tactical game fan, I chalk it up as one of my better purchases.

D&D is fairly expensive... the three "mandatory" books total over 100$, and I'm looking at my pile of just 4E probably total approaching 500$, if you count minis and the fact that I also have the For Dummies book because the index in the PHB and DMG is painfully bad.

I also have an Eldar Army for Warhammer 40k that (as Eldar have extremely specialized units, you have to invest more in them than most) exceeds 500$ itself.

Gaming isn't cheap, usually. And that's sad in a way because, much like the success of the Wii showed, sometimes low price point can win the day, and I think it'd be much easier to get folks to try RPGs if they didn't have to invest so much in a hobby they might not like.

Conversely, game companies know people will buy it. All it takes is one, and that one person can "sell" the game to a handful of friends. If it goes well, people will buy more supplements to get the powers and feats and talents and advantages they want. Name me a system you own the core book to that, if there are any available, you don't have at least one supplement for and you'll see what I mean.

[tesral]

Anymore I get sticker shock waking passed the LGS. Yea I know things have gotten more expensive as the years pass, but it is a 350% increase in the price of the Monster Manual for example from the first one.

[MortonStromgal]

The Cadwallen book was horribly expensive, but very pretty. Dark Ages Vampire I bought 4 times though. I bought 3 regular editions all of which the bindings came apart so I finally broke down and bought a limited edition

[Mindbomb]

Ptolus, jeez I want that so bad....

Warhammer/40k

[Arch Lich Thoth-Amon]

Arkham Horror and it's (several) expansions:

Arkham Horror - $59.95
-The Dunwich Horror - $49.95
-Curse of the Dark Pharoh - $24.95
-The King In Yellow - $24.95
-Kingsport Horror - $49.95
-Black Goat of the Woods - $24.95
-Innsmouth Horror - $49.95

Grand total: $284.65 plus tax

I've heard nothing but good things about this game, including that it can even be played single player. It's definitely on my wish list.

[mrken]

All games are expensive. The first game I started to buy was the original Traveler game. I must have a dozen, no, two dozen books. Then I bought into Star Frontiers, ehh, not too bad, what, maybe a dozen books. Then came DnD, ADnD, 2nd ed, 3.0, 3.5... I quit buying it about there. Then there are the minis. arghhhhh Everything is expensive.

What game would I like to buy but are too expensive? None of them are that appealing to me anymore. I been around the block a few times and have found what I really like is the role playing, not the game mechanics. In fact, generally the more the game costs, the less I like it. A twelve pound book has rules about the rules, that all have to be read, and understood before you can even play the game. Over the course of the last decade or so I have boiled down the games into very simple rules (if you can even call them rules). I reward rp. Characters go up in xp, not levels. Monsters can be anything. Information can be treasure. On and on and on.

That's right, friends. This is a thread to kvetch about games that you want, but aren't likely to get (at least any time soon), because they simply cost too many bones.

For example...

Pendragon and Nobilis are two games I've always wanted to play, but can never find any group actually playing them. Nobilis has mixed-to-positive reviews and looks intriguing, because of the high-quality artwork fronted on the rule book. For Pendragon it is equally hard to find a group running it, despite the fact that it generally has lots of popular positive support and good reviews online. So, someone's playing it somewhere, just nowhere near me.

I chalk this up partly to the fact that both, especially Nobilis, are pretty expensive. This frustrates me for obvious reasons. I mean, did they release a small print run just to drive up the price? Were they unexpectedly popular? Or, like the KISS comic books from days of yore, are they printed in the blood of their creators? What the heck? These days Nobilis is currently priced anywhere between $150 to $200 --and can only be found online. For a new unused copy, Pendragon's latest core edition will run you between $30 to $40, which, by way of comparison, is high-to-standard for other new White Wolf or WotC hardcover releases. BUT, the Pendragon campaign book runs upwards of $200! Seems ridiculous. Who has that kind of scratch to drop on games?

Anyhoo, for anyone who plays Pendragon or Nobilis and frequents the the PaPG forums, I'd like know more about how the system compares to, say, Ars Magica, etc. Is the White Wolf version the best? Why the heck is it so expensive do you think?

Tamburlain, I love Pendragon. I have the original version and GM'd it years ago. Was the single most engrossing game I have ever GM'd. The players would be calling me up every day after work to expand their characters and the holdings and all that. They came up with coats of arms and family lines, manor houses and methods to earn money. It was all very exciting.

As for why the Campaign book costs so much money, I'm not sure, but mine (original version has a ton of history which I believe was researched by the author). If you move to Denver, I will start up another game. Actually, now that you have started me to thinking about it, perhaps I will get things going to run half a dozen games at the next Genghis Con here in Denver. Who knows, perhaps I might find half a dozen people who would like to start a regular running campaign here in town.

[Tamburlain]

All games are expensive. The first game I started to buy was the original Traveler game. I must have a dozen, no, two dozen books. Then I bought into Star Frontiers, ehh, not too bad, what, maybe a dozen books. Then came DnD, ADnD, 2nd ed, 3.0, 3.5... I quit buying it about there. Then there are the minis. arghhhhh Everything is expensive.

What game would I like to buy but are too expensive? None of them are that appealing to me anymore. I been around the block a few times and have found what I really like is the role playing, not the game mechanics. In fact, generally the more the game costs, the less I like it. A twelve pound book has rules about the rules, that all have to be read, and understood before you can even play the game. Over the course of the last decade or so I have boiled down the games into very simple rules (if you can even call them rules). I reward rp. Characters go up in xp, not levels. Monsters can be anything. Information can be treasure. On and on and on.





Tamburlain, I love Pendragon. I have the original version and GM'd it years ago. Was the single most engrossing game I have ever GM'd. The players would be calling me up every day after work to expand their characters and the holdings and all that. They came up with coats of arms and family lines, manor houses and methods to earn money. It was all very exciting.

As for why the Campaign book costs so much money, I'm not sure, but mine (original version has a ton of history which I believe was researched by the author). If you move to Denver, I will start up another game. Actually, now that you have started me to thinking about it, perhaps I will get things going to run half a dozen games at the next Genghis Con here in Denver. Who knows, perhaps I might find half a dozen people who would like to start a regular running campaign here in town.

Haha, okay, cool. It's a bummer that Colorado is so far away. Like I said, I'd love to play Pendragon. Problem is, no one around my parts seems to run it. And as a GM, I already have a back-log of like 10 games that I own and can't find a group of players willing to play... So, if I made the investement, there would be little to no guarantee that I could entice anyone to play. :/

[mrken]

Too far??? What do you mean? Isn't Texas just next door to Colorado? We're like neighbors!!! lol

[Baron_Samedi]

I've got the set for Nobilis, both the Core book and the LARP rules...its rather unique because even though the system plays like a LARP, you can use the same rules set for just a sit-at-table system...i'm actually using the nobilis rules set and adapting it for White Wolf games, and hopefully going to continue it into a universal system for all games...It plays similar to white wolf...kinda like Scion, but bears similar feel to a game called Engel. Very etherial, free form...its has a lot, and i mean a LOT of complexity, but, has great potential...I've played it a couple of times, but here's the catch. You really have to have a balanced and trusted group to play with, it has the potential to get weird or at least awkward with a group you don't trust...its nothing lewd but very unique. Its been on my bookshelf for a bit...kind of a unicorn that i want to touch, but can't quite reach...as for the cost, it was originally produced around '99 by one company that folded, then picked up by another firm for the second edition, which then folded...and was supposed to be picked up by another party, but that was back in '08, so who knows? it sounds like a case of too weird, too different, to euro...doesn't have much of a market here against WotC, or white wolf...I collect RPG's so it wasn't much to pick one up online, but i've noticed that there are some beautifully played and written games that no one ever hears of...sad really.

[Tamburlain]

Too far??? What do you mean? Isn't Texas just next door to Colorado? We're like neighbors!!! lol

You've gotta be kidding. Even Texas is too far away from Texas, usually. And Colorado is not exactly what I'd call a small state land-wise, either.
--- Merged from Double Post ---

I've got the set for Nobilis, both the Core book and the LARP rules...its rather unique because even though the system plays like a LARP, you can use the same rules set for just a sit-at-table system......

.......It plays similar to white wolf...kinda like Scion, but bears similar feel to a game called Engel. Very etherial, free form...its has a lot, and i mean a LOT of complexity, but, has great potential...I've played it a couple of times, but here's the catch. You really have to have a balanced and trusted group to play with, it has the potential to get weird or at least awkward with a group you don't trust...its nothing lewd but very unique. ...I collect RPG's so it wasn't much to pick one up online, but i've noticed that there are some beautifully played and written games that no one ever hears of...sad really.

Hey, in August when I'm a free man, I'd drive to Lewisville to play Nobilis... that is, if you're willing to trust me.

[Baron_Samedi]

Well, don't break out of the pokey on my account...it usually runs best with at least three people. I'm not sure where my dead tree is packed away at...i just moved, but i do have a scanned copy. Plus i really don't want to lug around a $200 book. I've had people steal my stuff...not saying you would, but it is harder to replace than a 3.x phb. Sounds good...keep in touch...

[Oldgamer]

Well I look at D&D being pretty expensive, especially for one who's played it since Basic. If you take in the cost of Basic, Companion, Expert, Immortal, AD&D, 2e AD&D, 3.0, 3.5, and 4e ... and all the splat books therein ... that's a lot of money through the years. 3.5 splatbooks are very numerous, I'm not sure on the number, but I'd bet safely at around 70+? At around $30 a piece plus the other editions ... not to mention additional features such as mini's (especially the pewter ones), mapping software, DM screens, dice, etc ...