Would you play D&D if it wasn't D&D

**MortonStromgal** · 05-05-2009, 10:22 PM

I have a friend who uses nWOD for his Eberron game and recently I have been thinking about running the old Dragonlance adventures with Burning Wheel. So the question is how important is that D&D mechanic?

**Arch Lich Thoth-Amon** · 05-05-2009, 10:38 PM

I'd run it with WFRP rules.

**Sascha** · 05-05-2009, 10:41 PM

I'd use Spirit of the Century.

**Webhead** · 05-05-2009, 11:27 PM

I'd use:

Spirit of the Century
Savage Worlds
Wushu
Mutants & Masterminds

Rules-wise, all editions of D&D tend to be among my least favorite in one way or another. Fantasy is a fun genre but not all Fantasy need be D&D.

**Moritz** · 05-06-2009, 07:08 AM

D&D isn't D&D if it's not D&D.

For example, class based rules. Fantasy Hero (HERO System) is nothing but a fantasy hack done poorly. You can be do'anything'man and not specialize if you don't want.

Another example would be the monsters. Fantasy Hero deals more with humanoid enemies than true monsters. Sure, there are some, but what's the point. You just hit them till they're unconscious. D&D there is actual death.

If there's to be fantasy RP, then D&D needs to be the guide.

That's my opinion.

**fmitchell** · 05-06-2009, 06:07 PM

Originally Posted by Moritz

If there's to be fantasy RP, then D&D needs to be the guide.

That's a bit over-broad. Fantasy literature existed long before D&D, and D&D hardly epitomizes all fantasy. The world of Conan doesn't have Clerics or Wizards; it has evil NPC small-S sorcerers whose powers revolved around summoning Lovecraftian beings and using their power. Tolkien's only "wizards" were five angelic beings limited to mortal forms and, in D&D reckoning, about 5th level. Elric/Stormbringer and The Dying Earth model their respective literary works far better than D&D ever could, precisely because they were trying to. Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay, and its universe, are arguably a darker and more cynical take on D&D: some "clerics" become witch-burning fanatics for their god, "magic-users" risk the taint of Chaos with every spell, fighters can't actually take on a horde of goblins single-handedly, and most "adventurers" come from ignoble professions like "rat-catcher" or "valet". There's plenty of viable fantasy games, each written around different assumptions than D&D.

Given how D&D rules themselves have changed dramatically over the years, there might be better, easier mechanics than the official ones. WFRP has percentile stats and a career system that allows characters to buy appropriate Skills and Talents with their XP. I also know one person on these boards who converted D&D over to a variant of PDQ (using 2d10 instead of 2d6).

**Cardboard Tube Knight** · 06-09-2009, 10:54 PM

Originally Posted by Moritz

D&D isn't D&D if it's not D&D.

For example, class based rules. Fantasy Hero (HERO System) is nothing but a fantasy hack done poorly. You can be do'anything'man and not specialize if you don't want.

Another example would be the monsters. Fantasy Hero deals more with humanoid enemies than true monsters. Sure, there are some, but what's the point. You just hit them till they're unconscious. D&D there is actual death.

If there's to be fantasy RP, then D&D needs to be the guide.

That's my opinion.

I like the mechanics and feel of D&D 3.5

I like the rules too and when I run a game, I change the ones I don't want there, simple as that.

But do'anything'man made me laugh.

**Arch Lich Thoth-Amon** · 05-06-2009, 10:21 AM

To play Devil's Advocate: Many folks would argue that certain editions of dnd isnt dnd.

**Thorn** · 10-30-2011, 01:49 AM

Originally Posted by Arch Lich Thoth-Amon

To play Devil's Advocate: Many folks would argue that certain editions of dnd isnt dnd.

It is sad but true, THen everybody does have their tastes.

**Windstar** · 05-06-2009, 10:33 AM

There is only one other game I would play, "Morrow Project", but I use a mix of homebrew rules to play it. OBTW, all versions of D&D are D&D.

**Sascha** · 05-06-2009, 01:34 PM

Furthering the Devil's Advocate, there are arguments that at sufficiently high levels, certain editions' spellcasters were Do-Anything-Men.

**Moritz** · 05-06-2009, 06:29 PM

Sounds like a lot of non D&D hooey to me

**Webhead** · 05-06-2009, 07:29 PM

To me, D&D is just a vessel...a ferry to take me to a magical land of excitement and adventure. The de facto rules may not provide the smoothest ride for my tastes (hence why I've since gone walkabout and broadened my horizons a bit) but as long as it gets you to where you're wanting to go and does so in a pleasant way, then I say go with what makes you happy.

*Individual results may vary. The previous statements do not represent the views of Penandpapergames.com, its subsidiaries and shareholders...

**gajenx** · 05-07-2009, 05:43 PM

For me DnD is just the most common fantasy RPG game that my friends and I know well enough for all to have fun and not worry on rules. Though I will play and try anything for a while. I personnally love the expanded version of Runequest which at a high levle game players can be throwing fireballs that kill everything like in DnD, but to start you have to be careful since the system is more realistic than DnD ever will be, and unlike DnD you never gain more HP for the most part. Though I also love taking games like Scion and running it in a fantasy setting or anything as long as its fun. I do not mind other systems as each has their own pros and cons. My 2 favs no one will play or no one will run.

First fav is Runequest and no one plays it really anymore. My second is 7th Seas, though I suck at running it and no on will run it or play it.

**Arch Lich Thoth-Amon** · 05-07-2009, 05:52 PM

Originally Posted by gajenx

For me DnD is just the most common fantasy RPG game that my friends and I know well enough for all to have fun and not worry on rules. Though I will play and try anything for a while. I personnally love the expanded version of Runequest which at a high levle game players can be throwing fireballs that kill everything like in DnD, but to start you have to be careful since the system is more realistic than DnD ever will be, and unlike DnD you never gain more HP for the most part. Though I also love taking games like Scion and running it in a fantasy setting or anything as long as its fun. I do not mind other systems as each has their own pros and cons. My 2 favs no one will play or no one will run.

First fav is Runequest and no one plays it really anymore. My second is 7th Seas, though I suck at running it and no on will run it or play it.

I have the same troubles with WFRP, gajenx. Most players get turned off on WFRP when they find out their characters cant become "superheros" like in dnd. Then, of course, there are the ones that i talk into playing, and after their first experience, never want to play "cotton candy-bubble gum" (their descriptions) dnd again. They get so hooked on the grittiness, that when talking them into playing dnd again, they demand i make it gritty, unbalanced, and dark. Hey, no problems, for that's the only way i run it.