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DMMike
01-08-2009, 01:22 PM
I'm paging through my old Dragon issues, looking to streamline my closet, when I come across a Knight-class ability to defend another character from attack. It included a mechanic about giving Dodge bonus to another character, which I couldn't fathom, but it had me wondering:

How do you use the 3.5 rules to simulate body-guarding action? How does one character hide on the far side of another? Or how does one character move to consistently block another? Does Ready Action cover all the implications involved?

What other actions (like the infamous slide down a bannister) aren't clearly covered by the rules?

InvestFDC
01-08-2009, 01:39 PM
I think you just go with your gut or maybe try to play it out live. If a knight has an ability to continuously get inbetween and opponent and a friend then I can see there being a bonus. It probably should be some form of cover like that provided by a tower shield or other barrier. Or you could rule an attack of opportunity by the knight upon the the opponent when that opponent attacks the friend.

The books are only guides and not meant for your games to run on autopilot. And I'd rule the slide down the bannister as a double move in a standard action.

Inquisitor Tremayne
01-08-2009, 01:40 PM
You provide cover for your allies. That is the basic mechanic. Anything beyond that would be a feat or class feature.

Ready would allow you and your ally to move simultaneously, though, technically in game terms one of you is actually moving before the other but I wouldn't stress it too much, as long as you are on the same initiative it should be fine.

As far as sliding down a banister, it would require or count as a move action using up the necessary movement and I would also require a balance check DC X.

Farcaster
01-08-2009, 01:42 PM
You could use the "Aid Another" attack action to provide your ally a +2 AC bonus against an opponent's next attack. To do this, you take a standard action making an attack roll versus AC 10. If you succeed, you can grant your ally a +2 bonus to attack or AC against the opponent you choose.

Inquisitor Tremayne
01-08-2009, 01:44 PM
You could use the "Aid Another" attack action to provide your ally a +2 AC bonus against an opponent's next attack. To do this, you take a standard action making an attack roll versus AC 10. If you succeed, you can grant your ally a +2 bonus to attack or AC against the opponent you choose.

Really? It is +2 to attack OR AC? I never realized that! I have found a new tactic!

Farcaster
01-08-2009, 01:48 PM
Aye, +2 to either one as you choose. Very useful, and it can be stacked! So, if you find yourself in the situation where one person has a particularly useful attack (such as a bane weapon) while everyone else cannot do much to get past the opponent's DR (for instance) then multiple members could do this to help their ally get +4, +6 or even higher to his next attack -- or AC.

:biggrin:

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/specialAttacks.htm#aidAnother

Suzaku
01-08-2009, 01:59 PM
Aye, +2 to either one as you choose. Very useful, and it can be stacked! So, if you find yourself in the situation where one person has a particularly useful attack (such as a bane weapon) while everyone else cannot do much to get past the opponent's DR (for instance) then multiple members could do this to help their ally get +4, +6 or even higher to his next attack -- or AC.

:biggrin:

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/specialAttacks.htm#aidAnother


You're also forget allowing the person to power attack when otherwise he could not.

Farcaster
01-08-2009, 02:10 PM
I'm not sure how you accomplish giving someone a power attack with "Aid Another"... I haven't heard of that before.

Suzaku
01-08-2009, 02:16 PM
I'm not sure how you accomplish giving someone a power attack with "Aid Another"... I haven't heard of that before.
Let's say the fighter needed a 14 to hit and if the party gives him +6 to hit the fighter could now power attack because now he's not worrying about missing as much.

Inquisitor Tremayne
01-08-2009, 02:18 PM
I'm not sure how you accomplish giving someone a power attack with "Aid Another"... I haven't heard of that before.

I think he means aiding another to give them a bonus so they can use Power Attack to offset that bonus.

I was astonished to learn that the bonus applies to AC. I knew you could aid another on attack, just never knew it applied to AC, thats crazy!

Webhead
01-08-2009, 03:21 PM
I think he means aiding another to give them a bonus so they can use Power Attack to offset that bonus.

I was astonished to learn that the bonus applies to AC. I knew you could aid another on attack, just never knew it applied to AC, thats crazy!

Yes. The idea is that you are distracting or interfering with the opponents so that they are less likely to strike their target. It's a neat option, though I've not really seen it used in game very often. Since one has to forfeit their action to Aid Another, players tend to find other ways to level the playing field. Using it to add to an ally's attack roll though, has been done to great effect a few times.

Inquisitor Tremayne
01-08-2009, 03:53 PM
Yes. The idea is that you are distracting or interfering with the opponents so that they are less likely to strike their target. It's a neat option, though I've not really seen it used in game very often. Since one has to forfeit their action to Aid Another, players tend to find other ways to level the playing field. Using it to add to an ally's attack roll though, has been done to great effect a few times.

In our current game, my character and another cooperate to gain bonuses all the time, I am a rogue 2/fighter 2 and e is a rogue 1/fighter 1, flank and sneak attack all day long! It makes sense for our characters to aid another. Plus we will eventually be taking the Nightsong Enforce PrCs!!! Fun!

TAROT
01-08-2009, 10:39 PM
Re: Bodyguarding. I've seen a few variations of a feat along these lines:

Once per round, if adjacent ally is attacked, you can swap places with your ally and become the target of the attack. (Sometimes at the cost of an AoO.)

Meeki
01-09-2009, 08:44 AM
Well for aid other I would like to note you actually have to make an attack against a creature you wish to grant AC against. I believe there is a slight difference between 3.5 and 3.0 aid other although I always confuse the two.

Anyways, as far as bodyguard goes a dodge bonus is acceptable to grant purely from a mechanical purpose. Since dodge bonuses stack with everything, including themselves, it makes sense to grant it. Unfortunately I cannot think of a description of an action that doesn't make it sound like the Knight would be pushing or pulling his ward out of the way or standing behind his ward moving his arms, legs, and body around like a large puppet, helping him dodge blows.

I guess another way would be to create a class ability akin to Shield Other.

DMMike
01-09-2009, 09:49 AM
Ah, ye olde Aid Another! So the defending character would ready an Aid, and the defended character would ready a move action to the opposite side of the defender. At best, this would provide no attack on the defendee (out of reach). If in reach, +2 AC from aid and +4 AC from soft cover. Or if the attacker is inhumanly fast, just the +2 Aid bonus if the attacker is within reach.

Also not in the rules: momentum. A mounted fighter charges some poor sap in combat. After the ferocious lance attack, he and his horse aren't required to budge an inch! Worse, if the attacker wants to charge away (and doesn't have Ride-by-Attack), he could face three attacks: one from receiving a charge, another from the defender's next turn taking place immediately before his, and an Opportunity Attack as he charges away.

Honestly, I'm splitting hairs here. But maybe someone has tackled the issue?

Etarnon
01-09-2009, 09:11 PM
We use aid another a lot, especially in spycraft 2.0