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Xandros
10-14-2008, 06:58 AM
I had trouble deciding whether I should post this under Fantasy or Sci Fi. I decided to post it here since it will likely get more traffic. I have recently gotten inspired to do a Firefly (the television series) type universe with fantasy races and elements. Basically D&D with a western/Sci Fi setting. I haven't thought out too much yet, so I will add to this as I have more detailed questions. I want to use D20 D&D 3.5 as the base. I could use some suggestions and maybe some other resources that I could use that I can convert to the game. I am figuring on using the various D&D races (Dwarves etc.) as races from different planets of origin. I will need to change the racial abilities from a fantasy setting to fit with a sci-fi western setting. Off the top of my head I am thinking of going with a non magic universe. If I use elves in that case they will need to be totaly readapted. I could also use some reference ideas for diagrams of various types of spaceships. That's something I really don't want to create from scratch. Thanks in advance for any ideas.

Greylond
10-14-2008, 07:26 AM
Spelljammer would be a great resource for you to check out for this.

DeathByDM
10-14-2008, 07:55 AM
There is a Serenity RPG out there (came out in 2005). I browsed through it at Barnes and Noble a few weeks ago. It's not D20, but you could probably use the source material and convert it to D20 if you wanted.

Arch Lich Thoth-Amon
10-14-2008, 08:18 AM
Here's some links that you may be able to cannibalise. Keep us up to date with developments.

http://www.sff.net/people/kitsune/traveller/peter/starships.html

http://www.merzo.net/

http://www.utzig.com/traveller/iai.shtml

http://www.utzig.com/cgi-bin/iai/map_top.pl

http://www.people.iup.edu/pnwm/comparison.gif

http://www.travellermap.com/

cplmac
10-14-2008, 09:17 AM
Will you be going with what would probably be the obvious role for the dwarves as being the miners/prospectors? A suggestion for the evles would be to make them be most of the aristocratic types, mayor, merchants, etc. Will there be futuristic/scifi type weapons or will they basically be what was available back in the "Old West"? I am also curious to see with what the story is on how the races got there from the other planets.

Webhead
10-14-2008, 09:24 AM
As well as the Serenity RPG as DeathbyDM mentioned, there might also be some good info (especially since you want to run D&D 3.5) to be found in the Dragonstar RPG books published by Fantasy Flight Games.

Bearfoot_Adam
10-14-2008, 09:51 AM
Another place to go for ship design could be Seas of Blood ( a mongoose book). Yes they are sailing ships but they would give you a basic template to work off of as you convert the hull from wood to metal, and catapults to laser cannons.

As far as the elves needing a complete overhaul in a non magical setting I would just give them a different preferred class. Depending on what version of elves you want (civilized vs. Wild) they could either be rogues or any ranger variant from less magic oriented settings.

If races are from different planets and the a major theme of Firefly and westerns is life on the fringe does this mean that each race has it's own planetary frontiers?

tesral
10-14-2008, 10:05 AM
D20 Modern might be a better d20 base that D&D. There is also a "future" version I have never seen. That could be right up your alley.

Arch Lich Thoth-Amon
10-14-2008, 11:42 AM
There are alot of sci-fi free modules on the net as well. It sould help you when thinking up a clever scenario to run your gamers through.

Grimwell
10-14-2008, 04:29 PM
You can also check around for used copies of Alternity (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternity) and Star Frontiers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Frontiers) for a TSR influenced dose of space fantasy. Coming from the D&D company, you may find enough commonalities in the approach to the game to enjoy it.

Xandros
10-14-2008, 06:35 PM
Thanks for all the great suggestions. I haven't worked out the history yet. I figure that all the different races come from different planets within the same system, but travel freely between them. Most planets now contain a mix of all races, although many civilizations are still rather segregated. Dwarves will come from a mining planet, which will be their primary source of trade with other planets. Most travelling Dwarves will be warriors. Like I said, I haven't worked out the history yet, but I'm thinking they probably were a mining culture until a great war forced them to become soldiers. So far as weapons go, I am going to stay away from lasers and other future weapons and stick to projectiles like on Firefly/Serenity. Mostly sticking to old west style with the rare modern style weapons. There is a used copy of Alternity at my local Hastings. I will pick it up this week. I have all the old Star Frontiers stuff from ages ago. I need to get it out of storage. I will also see if I can find the Serenity role playing game. I am good at converting things. I would not be good at converting ship designs to space ship designs. I could convert stats, but I really want some visuals for players.

Xandros
10-14-2008, 06:49 PM
On consideration, it does appear that D20 modern will be the place to start and then convert the fantasy races. I have never played D20 future, but I will need to look it up.

nijineko
10-15-2008, 01:30 AM
for me, the greatest benefit of d20 future was that they converted all the star frontiers pc races to 3.x. =D for that alone i'd buy it. ^^

Mead
10-15-2008, 10:11 PM
Firefly had lasers, they were just very expensive and tended to attract lots of unwanted attention, making them rare outside the Core planets. They also didn't have very large power packs.

I would say the projectile weapons in Firefly had advanced targeting systems or possibly electronic firing mechanisms (a la Metal Storm (http://www.metalstorm.com/)), since they mostly all went *kcheee* when cocked and featured vastly expanded ammunition supplies.

Arch Lich Thoth-Amon
10-15-2008, 10:20 PM
Firefly had lasers, they were just very expensive and tended to attract lots of unwanted attention, making them rare outside the Core planets. They also didn't have very large power packs.

I would say the projectile weapons in Firefly had advanced targeting systems or possibly electronic firing mechanisms (a la Metal Storm (http://www.metalstorm.com/)), since they mostly all went *kcheee* when cocked and featured vastly expanded ammunition supplies.
I would agree. I always felt...also, that the guns in Firefly were high tech in regqards to construction and mechanisms while having an old design concept/appearance, most likley due to the popularity of such designs.

Therefore: Lighter, stronger, more powerful, more accurate, more reliable, fused with an old design for appearances.

Mead
10-16-2008, 06:52 PM
Because basically there's not much further to go in gun design, really. You've got an ammo feed, rectangular or cylindrical, you've got a trigger mechanism, you've got some kind of handle, you've got some kind of breech block, and you've got a barrel. And that's it for visual elements.

It's an amazingly simple design for what it does, and there hasn't been a sci-fi show yet with "futuristic but realistic guns" that hasn't looked like they were using obvious current-era guns with pointless bits and bobs added on. Until Firefly. All their futuristic stuff happens on the inside. (energy weapons are a different category, of course, but even in Star Wars, you could tell they were Sterlings)

At least, that's what it seems like the Firefly design teams decided when they were trying to represent weapons (OF THE FUTURE!). KISS. And it worked just fine. :)

Greylond
10-16-2008, 07:39 PM
Speculation that I've seen on various websites about the Firefly guns point out several interesting things.

1) They all must use caseless ammo since you never see any spent brass flying around.

2) Very few of the weapons have an actual mechanical trigger or cocking mechanism so they must use some sort of electrical cocking system and trigger. Note: whenever a pistol is cocked, i.e. Mal's, you hear an electronic whine/sound effect.

3) And yea, all the guns except for "New Tech" lasers and such seem to be modified designs from the 21st century.

tesral
10-16-2008, 09:55 PM
Well there is a trigger. There doesn't seem to be a hammer or not much of one. Magazine. looks to be forward. So it is an automatic with revolver looks. A couple of spots for a lanyard so I tend to think military sidearm. Thumb safety, the designer thought of all the details and clearly not a "modern" gun.

http://prophouse2000.com/fire2.jpg

Greylond
10-16-2008, 10:21 PM
Yea but if you watch clips from the show Mal's gun being fired you don't see his finger move to pull the trigger back. Also, you never see his finger move when he cocks the hammer. Actually, that "Safety Lock" that you mention on the side is where he puts his thumb when he cocks it...

tesral
10-16-2008, 10:25 PM
Yea but if you watch clips from the show Mal's gun being fired you don't see his finger move to pull the trigger back. Also, you never see his finger move when he cocks the hammer. Actually, that "Safety Lock" that you mention on the side is where he puts his thumb when he cocks it...

If it is a typical Hollywood prop, the trigger doesn't move.

Greylond
10-16-2008, 10:25 PM
Or, am I too much of a geek to watch that closely...:embarassed:

tesral
10-16-2008, 10:28 PM
Or, am I too much of a geek to watch that closely...:embarassed:

Answered own question. :nerd:

Greylond
10-16-2008, 10:53 PM
If it is a typical Hollywood prop, the trigger doesn't move.

Maybe for the stationary props. But they have different prop guns for "Action Shots". Some are mechanically working replicas, except that you can't load anything including blanks in them and others that are actual Blank Guns.

Besides, I like the idea of electronically fired caseless ammo being fired from what looks like 19th and 20th century style gunslinger weapons. Just seems to fit the Firefly image better IMO...

tesral
10-17-2008, 09:09 AM
Maybe for the stationary props. But they have different prop guns for "Action Shots". Some are mechanically working replicas, except that you can't load anything including blanks in them and others that are actual Blank Guns..

Average props make from urethane resin, nothing works. Stunt props made from the same molds, but with a urethane rubber that does not hurt you if you fall on it, they look terrible. Hero props have as much functionality as the prop maker can squeeze into it.

Looking the pistol and the fact it looks so different from any real gun I would off hand say the hero fired a propane jet, the usual method for making automatic weapons look like they work.




Besides, I like the idea of electronically fired caseless ammo being fired from what looks like 19th and 20th century style gunslinger weapons. Just seems to fit the Firefly image better IMO.

Knock yourself out. Never said that wasn't the case.

cplmac
10-17-2008, 09:38 AM
By the looks of the position of the front sight on the barrel and where it seems that the rear sight is possibly being above what little bit of a hammer there is, it seems that this particular weapon is not really meant to be aimed at a specific point on the users target.

tesral
10-17-2008, 09:41 AM
By the looks of the position of the front sight on the barrel and where it seems that the rear sight is possibly being above what little bit of a hammer there is, it seems that this particular weapon is not really meant to be aimed at a specific point on the users target.

It's a pistol, not much use past ten feet. Point and click interface.

cplmac
10-17-2008, 09:50 AM
Well, hell, if you're within 10 feet, you may as well be going hand to hand.

Greylond
10-17-2008, 11:44 AM
Rule #1 of a Knife(or Fist) Fight: ALWAYS Bring a Gun... ;)

Arch Lich Thoth-Amon
10-17-2008, 12:30 PM
The memory comes to mind of the original Indiana Jones where the swordsman came out from the crowd and swung his swords around, then Indy just pulled his gun and shot. Yep, always bring a gun to a knife...er...um sword fight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=plWnm7UpsXk&feature=related

placebosonly
10-17-2008, 04:36 PM
another thing you may not want to forget is the reavers, how will they overlap, since elves dont have magic just take them away as playing characters and just make them reavers simple and effective to the story

nijineko
10-19-2008, 12:48 AM
The memory comes to mind of the original Indiana Jones where the swordsman came out from the crowd and swung his swords around, then Indy just pulled his gun and shot. Yep, always bring a gun to a knife...er...um sword fight.

interestingly enough, that shot was NOT in the script. indy was supposed to pull out his whip and have a protracted sword vs whip fight. however, mr. ford happened to have a cold during the shoot. and was not feeling like it in the slightest. as you can tell if you watch his face closely. his gun being loaded with blanks, he just did what he felt like. *BAAM* and thus a new scene was born. ^^ mr. ford has a habit of doing that sort of thing, it seems.

Arch Lich Thoth-Amon
10-19-2008, 11:38 AM
interestingly enough, that shot was NOT in the script. indy was supposed to pull out his whip and have a protracted sword vs whip fight. however, mr. ford happened to have a cold during the shoot. and was not feeling like it in the slightest. as you can tell if you watch his face closely. his gun being loaded with blanks, he just did what he felt like. *BAAM* and thus a new scene was born. ^^ mr. ford has a habit of doing that sort of thing, it seems.
It was a great scene and it worked very well. I didnt know the trivia behind it. Thanks for posting.

nijineko
10-19-2008, 10:19 PM
i know a few more about indy jones and star wars too. =D

Arch Lich Thoth-Amon
10-20-2008, 11:32 AM
i know a few more about indy jones and star wars too. =D
Feel free to share. I'm curious.

nijineko
10-20-2008, 12:34 PM
in the beginning of the first indy movie, ever notice the serial number of the airplane that indy takes off in once he escapes from the tomb?

the two directors are known for sneaking references to each others films in like that. ;D

tesral
10-20-2008, 01:49 PM
in the beginning of the first indy movie, ever notice the serial number of the airplane that indy takes off in once he escapes from the tomb?

the two directors are known for sneaking references to each others films in like that. ;D

R2D2 in the hieroglyphs inside the tomb as well.