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Everith
06-29-2008, 01:53 PM
My friends and I have been playing DnD for quite some time now since 2nd edition. We've played some d20 modern enjoyed that for a little while. Played Star wars the version just prior to Saga Edition. That was ok i think we had problems with it do to the premade adventure we tried to play. We've just been playing fantasy too long and I'm trying to locate soemthing new. One more thing we tried was mutants and masterminds but that was a horrible experience the group got frustrated with the character creation and that left them jaded and not wanting to even really play.

I personally want to try a scifi or modern style game. I would REALLY like something scifi since we've never really given a scifi game more than a 1 session try. I'm looking for some suggestions of not only Games to look into but to tips to have the group try something new. These guys like what they like and trying new things is always a chore with them. Any and all help is very welcome.

Also if possible when reffering a game i would like to try and stay easy... for instance i looked at gurps and got kinda overwhelmed by the amount of books and i didn't wanna start buying since I hear a new edition is in the works?

Thank you to everyone in advance for all your help if anyone needs some more info before refering a game please ask and i will try and be swift on my answer once again thank you.

Highway Man
06-29-2008, 03:49 PM
You could try Rifts. Itís a mix of the technology and magic set on a future earth where there are monsters and such running around. There are a lot of books that go with Rifts, but in all honesty all you need is the core book and maybe 1-2 North America books to really have fun. Only reason to get the other books is if you are going to be globe trotting or actually want to read about what is happening in the rest of the world.

trechriron
06-29-2008, 04:01 PM
Traveller is THE universal sci-fi setting with a ridiculous amount of fan support. There are multiple versions in various systems. The information in the GURPS books (on sale for $9.99 a piece from SJGAmes (http://www.warehouse23.com/info/gurps.html#scifi)) is very useful even if you don't use GURPS as a system. Also the plethora of desk plans out there for Traveller and Fading Suns (done in Traveller style) is a bonus.

This setting spans across several time eras. There are multiple detailed sectors and systems, as well as whole areas left uncharted for you to detail. You can run Serenity style games, Star Trek style games, Star Wars styled games, mercenary games, merchant based games, exploration based games, the list goes on and on.

First, since your group is already familiar with d20 why not check out Traveller 20 (http://www.travellerrpg.com/) (T20)? It's already in a system your group knows.

Also Mongoose Publishing (http://www.mongoosepublishing.com/home/series.php?qsSeries=51) just started releasing a new updated version of the original system. Skill based (no classes or levels) system that is pretty simple.

Do some research. Almost any system has a conversion. I love the Savage Worlds (http://www.peginc.com/) system and there are 3 conversions (http://www.savageheroes.com/conversions.htm) for that system.

Even if you don't play in the Traveller setting, the enormous resources for the game can be pilferred for ideas, maps, adventures, ship designs, worlds, star maps, solar systems, et al.

Suggestion: Research one area in Traveller you like. Pick an adventure style you want to run, then focus your research, buying, and efforts on those supplements that will help you run that game. Start small. As the campaign progresses you can gather more resources and even expand the options of the campaign.

Just start exploring all the material out there for Traveller. I am sure you can find a system that fits your style and more resources than you could possibly use in a lifetime.

Webhead
06-30-2008, 09:15 AM
I'm very sorry to hear about your group's bad experience with Mutants & Masterminds. It really is an excellent game if you can spend the time absorbing the differences between it and standard d20. One of my favorite RPGs, actually, but I agree that character creation can be a little intensive the first time through.

As far as sci-fi games, if your group is willing to give another Star Wars game a try, I heartily recommend either the Star Wars D6 version published by West End Games, or the Saga Edition by WotC. Both are excellent game systems and D6 is so simple, even strict "d20" players shouldn't be turned off by it.

Alternity is another possibility, but I know it's out of print and my actual experience with the game is limited. The system did seem a little funky at the time, but I never read the whole thing. A lot of people seem to like it.

Cyberpunk 2020 is a really good game with really simple rules, but it is also a very lethal game, so if your PCs go around trying to get into gun fights, they'll tend to end up in either the hospital or the morgue.

Then there's the Serenity and Battlestar Galactica RPGs, which are pretty new and use an interesting and fairly simple system.

Other than that, there's not much else I can recommend with confidence as I've had difficulty finding good sci-fi games myself.

Let us know how things go.

Inquisitor Tremayne
06-30-2008, 09:39 AM
Yes Yes to Webhead you listen!

Everything he said I recommend as well!

Oh course I am going to push Star Wars Saga Edition a little bit more because it is my new favorite game system. And its Star Wars!

Webhead
06-30-2008, 11:25 AM
...Oh course I am going to push Star Wars Saga Edition a little bit more because it is my new favorite game system. And its Star Wars!

I'll admit that despite my initial misgivings about it (the general "d20" burn out I was facing over the last few years and the fact that I'd played and wasn't impressed with both previous editions of d20 Star Wars), Saga Edition has really impressed me. It's the version of d20 I wished D&D 3e had been released under back in 2000.

Beyond that, I've found it supremely easy to run and to prepare for both in terms of creating npcs and making fast, exciting encounters.

I'm not sure that Saga could ever completely replace D6's place in my heart (having been my bread-and-butter RPG for 13 years) nor should it, but Saga Edition is still excellent and very worth of the Star Wars license.

tesral
06-30-2008, 11:51 AM
Bureau 13 (http://members.aol.com/TRITACGAMES/Bureau13.htm). It's modern, it has SF overtones and a bit of the mystical as well. Fun game, very customizable to the way you prefer to play.

Skunkape
07-01-2008, 08:44 AM
I love the Savage Worlds (http://www.peginc.com/) system and there are 3 conversions (http://www.savageheroes.com/conversions.htm) for that system.

Thanks for the conversions link, that'll be really helpful for me!:focus:

clash
07-02-2008, 08:54 AM
Some SF games I really like:

Hard Nova ][ (http://www.pigames.net/store/default.php?cPath=32&osCsid=17cf0ea8e5cee35a30d72d13d15d6e82) A light, flexible system with a sweet setting - a stellar federation of humans and aliens expanding, ecploring, and meeting new species

Nebuleon (http://neb.hinterwelt.com/) - Humans are the cockroaches of the game, having fled here from some disaster they are homeless newcomers in an alien universe.

Lightspeed (http://www.lightspeed-rpg.com/) - Mash Star Wars and Star Trek together with Space Rangers.

Shebang! (http://www.timelessgamez.com/) - Earth is long gone, and humanity lives on a bleak, cyberpunkish terraformed Mars.

Also there are my SF games:

StarCluster 2 (http://jalan.flyingmice.com/starcluster.html) - Humans fled a destroyed solar system thousands of years ago in slower than light colony ships, arriving in the Cluster 500 years ago.

Cold Space (http://jalan.flyingmice.com/coldspace.html) - The Cold War in space - an FTL/antigravity device was discovered in 1949 and the race for the stars was on. Covers 1949-1989.

FTL Now (http://jalan.flyingmice.com/ftlnow.html) - The sequel to Cold Space - Colonial separatists ram a comet into the Earth, and half the people on Earth die from the aftereffects. Now the colonies are on their own willy-nilly. Covers 1990-now.

Note - all these systems are considerably lighter than D&D in prep time, and all can be played with just the core book, though most have optional supplements.

-clash

trechriron
07-02-2008, 12:44 PM
Thanks for the conversions link, that'll be really helpful for me!:focus:

My Pleasure. Now REALLY :focus: ...

Everith
07-02-2008, 05:45 PM
My 1 friend and i have settled on Star Wars for couple reason... First we both know the IP VERY. Second it's a mix between 3rd and 4th editions in the system so it'll be very easy to migrate. And last KOTOR comming out and we're huge KOTOR nerds.... the only thing we're changing is it says level 1 jedi= padawan and since I DO NOT want everyone who makes a jedi to wanna start our game at level 7+ I needed to discard that little tidbit for the current mission i'll be running... I wanted to try the new traveler and a bunch of the others posted but it was impossible to convince my group.... they like sticking to easy I THOUGH M+M was easy to learn but it was like teaching a salamander physics... anyway thanks again everyone

Inquisitor Tremayne
07-03-2008, 06:27 AM
My 1 friend and i have settled on Star Wars for couple reason... First we both know the IP VERY. Second it's a mix between 3rd and 4th editions in the system so it'll be very easy to migrate. And last KOTOR comming out and we're huge KOTOR nerds.... the only thing we're changing is it says level 1 jedi= padawan and since I DO NOT want everyone who makes a jedi to wanna start our game at level 7+ I needed to discard that little tidbit for the current mission i'll be running... I wanted to try the new traveler and a bunch of the others posted but it was impossible to convince my group.... they like sticking to easy I THOUGH M+M was easy to learn but it was like teaching a salamander physics... anyway thanks again everyone

My pleasure!

I think you will find Saga to be very simple for them to catch on.

The only difficulties I have had from running it have been getting players out of the D&D 3.5 mode of thinking, (hack & slash, kill everything, and loot the bodies) and getting used to the minor rules differences.

Otherwise it is lots of fun to play!

MortonStromgal
07-23-2008, 05:01 PM
If Star Wars doesn't work out I suggest Dark Heresy (Warhammer 40k), simple fast rules and most D&D guys can get it in a couple sessions.

Chris House
08-05-2008, 02:31 PM
ok all of these post suggestions where good, but I can offer you better- try Starfrontiers!
http://www.starfrontiersman.com/downloads/remastered

this is why its better
10. its free
09. it has both simple basic rules expanded rules and all new rules
08. its free
07. it has a great little fan supported magazine
06.the magazine is free
05.its old school gaming and its very flexible system
03. take five minute to make characters
02. you can learn the whole game in one evening of reading
01.! its free!
<we wanted to use four, but he got unruly and had to be shoot!>:eek:

nijineko
08-08-2008, 04:32 PM
considering that the number four has connotations of death in japanese, that's entirely appropriate! ^^

i vote for star frontiers, if for no other reason than nostalgia!

=D

Arch Lich Thoth-Amon
08-09-2008, 03:45 AM
I'll have to go with Traveller. Incredible game with incredible support.

Here is a support site, not unlike this one: www.travellerrpg.com (http://www.travellerrpg.com)

Here is the space map(this will have you drooling): www.travellermap.com (http://www.travellermap.com)

Best of luck & Game On!

Thoth-Amon

abnormalforaGamer
10-09-2008, 07:30 PM
I personally would suggest shadowrun if you are looking for something different, lots of fun but uses many d6's as opposed to d20, I personally love it but it is futuristic and has magic and technology in an interesting marriage

nijineko
10-09-2008, 09:24 PM
One of my favorite RPGs, actually, but I agree that character creation can be a little intensive the first time through.

it took me weeks to figure out my character the first time through. most of that was breaking the character down to the right point level though, as i was using a character that has a lot of reference materials useful for determining the abilities of the character. but trying to break them down to the right point value required a lot of painful trimming of core concepts.

raven21
10-10-2008, 09:36 AM
I love the Savage Worlds (http://www.peginc.com/) system and there are 3 conversions (http://www.savageheroes.com/conversions.htm) for that system.

I agree savage worlds is an easy gaem to play and you can run it with only the core book. If you want to play in a certin setting then all you need extra is the one setting book and it has quite a few settings. Personaly I like Nessary Evil. You play as super villians that have baned together to take the world back from an evil race of aliens after they killed all the superheros.

My second segestion is Kult its a mordern day horror sifi game it mixes magic, technology, and faith into a d20 system. It will make you question the world we live in. I know it just had a 3e relase which I don't know much about, but 2e was great and you can run it with only the core book its got many supalments.

Arch Lich Thoth-Amon
10-10-2008, 09:40 AM
ok all of these post suggestions where good, but I can offer you better- try Starfrontiers!
http://www.starfrontiersman.com/downloads/remastered

this is why its better
10. its free
09. it has both simple basic rules expanded rules and all new rules
08. its free
07. it has a great little fan supported magazine
06.the magazine is free
05.its old school gaming and its very flexible system
03. take five minute to make characters
02. you can learn the whole game in one evening of reading
01.! its free!
<we wanted to use four, but he got unruly and had to be shoot!>:eek:
Cant go wrong with Star Frontiers. I love this game.

Arch Lich Thoth-Amon
10-10-2008, 09:42 AM
Some SF games I really like:

Hard Nova ][ (http://www.pigames.net/store/default.php?cPath=32&osCsid=17cf0ea8e5cee35a30d72d13d15d6e82) A light, flexible system with a sweet setting - a stellar federation of humans and aliens expanding, ecploring, and meeting new species

Nebuleon (http://neb.hinterwelt.com/) - Humans are the cockroaches of the game, having fled here from some disaster they are homeless newcomers in an alien universe.

Lightspeed (http://www.lightspeed-rpg.com/) - Mash Star Wars and Star Trek together with Space Rangers.

Shebang! (http://www.timelessgamez.com/) - Earth is long gone, and humanity lives on a bleak, cyberpunkish terraformed Mars.

Also there are my SF games:

StarCluster 2 (http://jalan.flyingmice.com/starcluster.html) - Humans fled a destroyed solar system thousands of years ago in slower than light colony ships, arriving in the Cluster 500 years ago.

Cold Space (http://jalan.flyingmice.com/coldspace.html) - The Cold War in space - an FTL/antigravity device was discovered in 1949 and the race for the stars was on. Covers 1949-1989.

FTL Now (http://jalan.flyingmice.com/ftlnow.html) - The sequel to Cold Space - Colonial separatists ram a comet into the Earth, and half the people on Earth die from the aftereffects. Now the colonies are on their own willy-nilly. Covers 1990-now.

Note - all these systems are considerably lighter than D&D in prep time, and all can be played with just the core book, though most have optional supplements.

-clash
Very cool. Thanks for listing links. I'm definitely going to be checking these out.

Webhead
10-10-2008, 10:26 AM
it took me weeks to figure out my character the first time through. most of that was breaking the character down to the right point level though, as i was using a character that has a lot of reference materials useful for determining the abilities of the character. but trying to break them down to the right point value required a lot of painful trimming of core concepts.

Yeah, it's a "pure point-based" game and, at the default power level, it does give you a lot of them.

M&M's ease of use tends to depend on how a person sets about building their character. I'm a more "generalist" builder and I go for the fastest, simplest way to get my point across in M&M. If I want my character to fire heat-seeking rockets, I buy the Blast power and give it the Homing extra. Done and done. But not everyone designs this way and M&M will facilitate getting as "nitty-gritty" as you want to with it.

In short, I think M&M can be as straightforward or as complex as you want to get with it and I think it manages both well. Simple enough to get your point across easily, but complex enough to really "customize" if that's what you want to do.

In my experience, M&M as a tool box is more streamlined and internally consistant (and easier to wade through) than HERO or GURPS which are two of the other biggest "point-buy, sandbox" systems. That's not me knocking either of those systems as "bad", but just saying that M&M flows through my brain better than they do. It takes me much less time and effort to build an M&M character than a HERO or GURPS character of equivalent power scale. As someone once wrote: M&M can do 90% of what HERO can do in half the time.

Even then though, M&M can get more complex than some people are used to or comfortable with simply because it gives you all the options up front and doesn't tell you what you can or can't do with them. M&M requires a GM who can help guide unfamiliar players to the right place when making their PCs. That's one of the reasons that M&M gives so many sample PCs to uses as a guideline of how to build certain concepts.

DeadMike
10-20-2008, 04:40 AM
Also Mongoose Publishing (http://www.mongoosepublishing.com/home/series.php?qsSeries=51) just started releasing a new updated version of the original system. Skill based (no classes or levels) system that is pretty simple.
Having read and unfortunately purchased the core rules, I would suggest getting the CT (Classic Traveller) cd. Huge amount of info for cheap. Don't need to use it all if you don't want to. The Mongoose version is not very good, and not worth the cash.

clash
10-21-2008, 07:27 AM
Very cool. Thanks for listing links. I'm definitely going to be checking these out.

You're very welcome, Thoth-Amon!

-clash

MortonStromgal
10-24-2008, 10:11 AM
Personally I like the Mongoose Traveller. Its more of a tool kit than an actual setting and the rules are close to CT. Mongoose however does charge more than their compilation for their books, the only one that seamed like a good value was Conan Atlantian edition but in the case of Traveller you can download the SRD for free and check out the rules before you buy.

tesral
10-24-2008, 11:59 AM
GURPS Traveler is a must. The source books are a must have even if you hate the system. I have Alien Races 1-4 and I don't even play the game. I want more of them.

nijineko
10-24-2008, 05:52 PM
one of gurps strengths is lots and lots of ideas to draw from. ^^

Webhead
10-26-2008, 09:38 PM
I was browsing through GURPS: Vehicles at the used bookstore the other day. Yikes! Just browsing the book made me want to cry. I definately don't need that much detail in my RPG. But I guess that's what some people want and if so, more power to them, I guess...

nijineko
10-26-2008, 10:11 PM
yeah, they drew from car wars for gurps vehicles. now there's some detailed vehicles rules! ^^

Webhead
10-26-2008, 11:31 PM
yeah, they drew from car wars for gurps vehicles. now there's some detailed vehicles rules! ^^

Ooh! Car Wars! Now that was a fun game! Very detail-intensive but very rewarding. Especially when you get to run down one of the players whose motorcycle wrecked and now has to hoof it to the arena exit on foot! Poor guy! He never stood a chance! :pound:

nijineko
10-26-2008, 11:34 PM
oh i loved car wars! and when my dad showed up one day with the (very rare) champions-autoduel car wars crossover supplement, i about flipped. i mean, super-powers in car wars? rock on! forget the weapons... just start flinging bolts out the armored view slits!

i still play autoduel to this day. lucky me, my dad had his original disks, so i gets to run it on an emulator. =D

Webhead
10-26-2008, 11:47 PM
I really want to run Car-Toon Wars, a Car Wars campaign setting for the Toon RPG. Deck out your vehicle with pie launchers and banana peel droppers, and of course, elevator wheels! I know at least one player in my group (a Car Wars fan) who would be up for it.

tesral
10-27-2008, 12:26 AM
Another game I have floating around the house, Car Wars. That goes back a ways.

Greylond
10-27-2008, 01:08 AM
I really want to run Car-Toon Wars, a Car Wars campaign setting for the Toon RPG. Deck out your vehicle with pie launchers and banana peel droppers, and of course, elevator wheels! I know at least one player in my group (a Car Wars fan) who would be up for it.

It wasn't quite Toon, but one time a bunch of us put Foam Guns(shot the Firefighting Foam) on our vehicles for a duel. Lots of slipping and sliding around! Also, blocked vision through windshields until washed off...

nijineko
10-27-2008, 02:39 AM
Another game I have floating around the house, Car Wars. That goes back a ways.

i keep getting talked into selling mine. i need to find another one and keep it this time. ^^

Webhead
10-27-2008, 09:16 AM
i keep getting talked into selling mine. i need to find another one and keep it this time. ^^

I saw the original, complete Car Wars boxed set at Half Price Books for $20 and have no idea why I didn't grab it then and there. Of course, the next day when I came to my senses and ran back to snatch it up...it was gone. :(

DeadMike
10-27-2008, 12:50 PM
I saw the original, complete Car Wars boxed set at Half Price Books for $20 and have no idea why I didn't grab it then and there. Of course, the next day when I came to my senses and ran back to snatch it up...it was gone. :(

Ouch, that hurts. I love my box set, would never sell that thing. Picked it up at a used book store cheap.... unopened! There are some foolish people out there. Never knew what they had. Oh well, I enjoy it.
Mike

Arch Lich Thoth-Amon
10-27-2008, 01:16 PM
Wow! Car Wars. Now that brings back memories. Really, really fun game.

<having flashbacks>

Webhead
10-27-2008, 01:17 PM
Ouch, that hurts. I love my box set, would never sell that thing. Picked it up at a used book store cheap.... unopened! There are some foolish people out there. Never knew what they had. Oh well, I enjoy it.

Indeed. At the very same book store, I also regretfully passed up a complete copy of the In Search of Adventure module series for $10, the only copy I've ever seen in person. I put it back thinking that I would never use it and still regret that decision.

Damn me and my frugal spending habits...

nijineko
10-27-2008, 11:24 PM
my wife chides me all the time for picking up useless stuff. but when she secretly goes through my stuff to winnow out junk, it's amazing what she leaves in there, cause she knows me that well. ^^ she really does love me. =D

now i just need to have the money and timing to wander by some of those fortunate finds. ^^

DeadMike
10-28-2008, 01:26 PM
Indeed. At the very same book store, I also regretfully passed up a complete copy of the In Search of Adventure module series for $10, the only copy I've ever seen in person. I put it back thinking that I would never use it and still regret that decision.

Damn me and my frugal spending habits...

Ouch! Sounds like you need to grab some cash and head to that book store. I always set aside a small amout of cash for books and / or games.

Webhead
10-28-2008, 02:49 PM
Ouch! Sounds like you need to grab some cash and head to that book store. I always set aside a small amout of cash for books and / or games.

Yeah, the problem is, the moment I change my mind and go back looking for them, they are always gone. I went back the next day to pick up Car Wars...gone. Went back when I decided that I would go ahead and get In Search of Adventure...gone.

So, if I see something cool that I want, I have to either be certain that I want it then and there or else it will disappear.

I passed up a copy of bloody Castle Falkenstein (the only copy I've seen in person) for $5 at a FLGS before it closed down. Why? Why didn't I just buy it then? At the time I was just thinking, "I don't need yet another RPG". :doh:

DeadMike
10-29-2008, 02:12 PM
Just seems to me that is you haven't seen one before or if you see something you enjoy for cheap, grap it!! You seem to find a lot of stuff at the shops you visit, maybe you should go shopping. Mike

Webhead
10-29-2008, 02:28 PM
Just seems to me that is you haven't seen one before or if you see something you enjoy for cheap, grap it!! You seem to find a lot of stuff at the shops you visit, maybe you should go shopping. Mike

I find the good stuff when I'm not looking for something. If I go in looking, I won't find anything worthwhile.

But...I may just have to swing by Half Price Books on the way home from work today...just in case. ;)