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Schmall
06-04-2008, 02:32 PM
Just an interesting thought I came up with. Take a thunderstone for example. The idea is to lob it into an area and deafen foes with a hope of stunning for a round (I think, dont have the PHB in front of me since i am at work), but what if you were to sling instead. Sure, a total miss would go far behind them and do nothing, but a hit means damage as a slung stone and its effects. The question is how to figure that. I think something along this effect for a method of determining success on damage and effects......

Target total AC: 20
touch AC: 12

So if I come up with a "to hit" equal to or greater than 20, the thunder stone strikes for damage and effects, but if I get, lets say, a 15 total, then the thunderstone simply strikes the target and the thunderstone bounces off the armor or shield. However, the effects of the thunderstone still comes into effect since it struck something.

This thought applies to all nifty things suck as acid flasks, alchemist fire, or whatever that will fit in a sling. This would also increase the range of said item to, but I wouldnt give it full sling range since it wont fly as well as a sling bullet or stone.

Any thoughts on this. I think its a pretty cool idea and to go in my nasty trick list I have.

Valdar
06-04-2008, 04:07 PM
I guess it depends on how you envision a thunderstone activating. I'm tending to think it crumbles on impact and releases its bang (like those fireworks that explode when you throw them at hard surfaces). If it crumbles, then you don't get the same damage as a sling bullet that's hard enough to go through the target.

Same with flasks and such- if the item is destroyed on use, that tells me that it's the item and not the target taking the damage. Otherwise you'd have a pretty decent chance that the object would survive the impact, and you wouldn't get your cool effect.

This is not to say you can't get good at firing said things from a sling (or staff sling) to get more range, though.

tesral
06-04-2008, 10:57 PM
So if I come up with a "to hit" equal to or greater than 20, the thunder stone strikes for damage and effects, but if I get, lets say, a 15 total, then the thunderstone simply strikes the target and the thunderstone bounces off the armor or shield. However, the effects of the thunderstone still comes into effect since it struck something.

This thought applies to all nifty things suck as acid flasks, alchemist fire, or whatever that will fit in a sling. This would also increase the range of said item to, but I wouldnt give it full sling range since it wont fly as well as a sling bullet or stone.

Any thoughts on this. I think its a pretty cool idea and to go in my nasty trick list I have.


It's a concept worth looking into, as the post above mentions, be certain how your "stuff" works as to whether it will cause damage if someone is struck with it. However I see no reason why any balanced hand thrown missile cannot be given greater range with a sling. Be that thunderstones or alchemist fire.

I would also think that the grenade like missile rules would also apply to some ammunition. All the sling is, is a method of increasing the force and range an object can be thrown. I would say any fist sized object or smaller and I like your rule for touch vs hit for damage.

Schmall
06-05-2008, 02:58 PM
I have been thinking more on this because I have a character with craft (alchemy). I have enough gold to pay for nice round flask instead of tube like vials. This takes care of accuracy issues since round things just simply fly better.

As for damage, I dont expect a shattering glass flask to deal damage equal to a sling bullet, but it can deal like an extra 1-2 or simply 1. Not much, but at low levels, it can make all the difference.

As for the sling itself as a weapon, you can make one out of a strip of cloth. Remeber that next you are captured and have no weapons. It can also be used like a flail when loaded. An improvised flail is better than unarmed (without the needed feat) when you cant afford to hand out AoO. This is why all my charecters wear leather belts. They are actually slings =) Just never know when you need ranged bludgeoning damage ;)

tesral
06-05-2008, 05:53 PM
As for the sling itself as a weapon, you can make one out of a strip of cloth. Remeber that next you are captured and have no weapons. It can also be used like a flail when loaded. An improvised flail is better than unarmed (without the needed feat) when you cant afford to hand out AoO. This is why all my charecters wear leather belts. They are actually slings =) Just never know when you need ranged bludgeoning damage ;)

I'll have to keep that in mind. My character wears a sash. Easy enough to conceal a sling in that. But how much need does a Warlock have of improvised weapons? It might be a good call to re-equip the fighters however. He has carried a staff for 6 levels and never hit anyone with it.

I just might give up on the stick.

agoraderek
06-06-2008, 01:23 AM
Same with flasks and such- if the item is destroyed on use, that tells me that it's the item and not the target taking the damage. Otherwise you'd have a pretty decent chance that the object would survive the impact, and you wouldn't get your cool effect.

having been on the receiving end of a thrown perfume bottle (small, about the size i'd envision a d&d flask), i gotta say; it hurt! might be worth a point or two of damage. (admittedly, though, it didnt break until it hit the wall after hitting my head...). i might have to give you the thunderstone, though, i dont know how they work either.


I have been thinking more on this because I have a character with craft (alchemy). I have enough gold to pay for nice round flask instead of tube like vials. This takes care of accuracy issues since round things just simply fly better.

As for damage, I dont expect a shattering glass flask to deal damage equal to a sling bullet, but it can deal like an extra 1-2 or simply 1. Not much, but at low levels, it can make all the difference.

As for the sling itself as a weapon, you can make one out of a strip of cloth. Remeber that next you are captured and have no weapons. It can also be used like a flail when loaded. An improvised flail is better than unarmed (without the needed feat) when you cant afford to hand out AoO. This is why all my charecters wear leather belts. They are actually slings =) Just never know when you need ranged bludgeoning damage ;)

dude, i like the way you think. i may have to incorporate your idea if i ever find myself playing a rogue again ;)

tesral
06-06-2008, 06:41 AM
having been on the receiving end of a thrown perfume bottle (small, about the size i'd envision a d&d flask), i gotta say; it hurt! might be worth a point or two of damage. (admittedly, though, it didnt break until it hit the wall after hitting my head...). i might have to give you the thunderstone, though, i dont know how they work either.

Perfume bottles tend to be thick for their size. I would imagine that a flask intended to break would be made of thinner stuff.

There is also nature's potion flask, the blown goose egg. These would likely be best for powers, but with magic like the mend spell there is no reason liquids could not be so contained. Use a tool to slice off the little end, empty, rinse, dry, refill, mend. I recomend a boiled leather carrying case. :eek:

Schmall
06-06-2008, 01:27 PM
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There is also nature's potion flask, the blown goose egg. These would likely be best for powers, but with magic like the mend spell there is no reason liquids could not be so contained. Use a tool to slice off the little end, empty, rinse, dry, refill, mend. I recomend a boiled leather carrying case. :eek:

Goose egg. I like that. Just be sure to have cotton in the boiled leather to keep it safe. Geesh, we dont have to put just alchemist fire and such in there. Even dust for blinding/sneezing (try casting a spell while sneezing), poison powders, smoke bombs, or whatever has some kind of area effect. Heck, fill it with a potion of impact. Just be sure not to pour the liquid in. Use a rag to siphon it in. (Some cleric quartet in forgotten realms I got that from).

As for your fighter with the staff tesral, swap it with a spear instead. works as a walking staff, works as a pole, and can prod the ground ahead of you when in swaps or dungeons. Plus, on round 1, you can throw it and draw your real weapon.

Got a trapped chest and no rogue?? place a rope with a large sliding knot around the trap (dont touch it!), stand in the other room or behind a turned over table, and then yank the chest away from the trap. If its a needle trap, keep yanking it around until its out of ammo or broken. Ticked off one DM with that since he thought he had us with no rogue in the party. Acid flasks are good for locks too.

Before I forget, keep in mind that sling damage include your str bonus. So a 6' 5" half orc barbarian that slings a goose egg full of alchemist fire will hurt a lot, even if you only calculate the bludgeoning damage as non-lethal (it is an egg after all, but it hurts being hit by one, believe me).

Sorry for the long winded, many thoughts, of a post. I have access to the net here at work and sonic wall doesnt block this site.

tesral
06-07-2008, 12:29 AM
As for your fighter with the staff tesral, swap it with a spear instead. works as a walking staff, works as a pole, and can prod the ground ahead of you when in swaps or dungeons. Plus, on round 1, you can throw it and draw your real weapon.

He's a Warlock. The real weapon is the eldrich blast. That is why the stick has never been used.

Oh and I did mentioned that goose eggs are usually used for powders.

Schmall
06-09-2008, 04:04 PM
He's a Warlock. The real weapon is the eldrich blast. That is why the stick has never been used.


Ahhhh... That makes sense.

tesral
06-09-2008, 04:11 PM
Ahhhh... That makes sense.

I did get the sling. It's hidden in his sash. For one of his companions to use if required. It's dicedly hard to deprive a Warlock of his abilities.

He also carries a masterwork short sword, but doesn't use a sword. It's both a distraction and a tool. A stick he doesn't swing, a sword he doesn't stab with, and sling he doesn't sling.

I might have a bayonet hilt put on the sword and a cap on the staff to lock to it. Instant spear.