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PnP News Bot
12-17-2007, 09:54 AM
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Check out this new article Wizards of the Coast posted recently:

Conception of a Full-Time Wizard (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/drcw/20071214)

Reality merges with fantasy. Or would that be fantasy merging with reality? Or fantasy merging with fantasy?

Farcaster
12-17-2007, 12:02 PM
"Oooh, sorry," he counters, sounding alarmingly close to Wink Martindale. "Sorcerers arenít part of 4th Edition yet."

I dunno... I might be okay with them leaving sorcerers out of the game entirely. I didn't find that I needed them in 2nd edition, and I didn't find that I particularly cared for them in 3rd. Perhaps it is because all to often the sorcerer just ends up being a battery of attack spells. I prefer a spell caster with a wide array of magical options that leave the character room to be creative. Sorcerers just don't seem to fit that bill very well.

Riftwalker
12-17-2007, 12:30 PM
I dunno... I might be okay with them leaving sorcerers out of the game entirely. I didn't find that I needed them in 2nd edition, and I didn't find that I particularly cared for them in 3rd. Perhaps it is because all to often the sorcerer just ends up being a battery of attack spells. I prefer a spell caster with a wide array of magical options that leave the character room to be creative. Sorcerers just don't seem to fit that bill very well.

Agree, though at the same time part of the weakness (or playstyle if you prefer) of a wizard in 3.5 is that they have to know what spells they're going to want to cast ahead of time. (I know I know the sorcerer doesn't have the wealth of spells...)

I think a hybrid base-class between these two would be interesting, without having to multiclass Ultimate Magus or something. I'm fond of wizards, but how often does the player of a wizard think to himself: "If only I'd memorized this spell instead of that one."

I would suspect that in 4th Edition where they're making Vancian magic more of an adjunct capability than a primary one, this sort of hybrid 3.5 wizard/3.5 sorcerer will be present, both being folded into the 4.0 wizard concept.

Farcaster
12-17-2007, 12:44 PM
Personally, I'd go for a wizard who could cast anything off his memorized spell list, without "burning" it out of memory. The wizard could use some sort of spell point pool (mana). That would create a hybrid of sorts, since he'd be able to cast anything from memory multiple times, but he'd also be able to go back to his spell book and change up his line up. It would also do away with the somewhat silly notion that the wizard or sorcerer could be completely depleted of a lower level of spells, and be unable to convert higher level "spell slots"

Unearthed Arcana for 3rd edition had an alternative for spell points, but for whatever reason, I could never get my spell casting players to go for it.

Digital Arcanist
12-17-2007, 08:18 PM
Don't need sorcerers because you have Warlocks in the PHB. They are far superior to sorcerers.

Farcaster
12-17-2007, 09:42 PM
Were warlocks fixed up from the version presented in the Complete Arcane? Perhaps it is just because there were some documentation errors, but they seemed a little to confusing to use and not very versatile. They had even less spell variation than the sorcerer, so that would be going the opposite direction from what I am looking for.

Digital Arcanist
12-17-2007, 10:20 PM
Invocations were spread throughout a few different books. They have altered a bit for 4e though.

rabkala
12-18-2007, 08:50 PM
Things like Sorcerers, warlocks, and prestige classes usually hurt a group to an extent. It is far more difficult for 4 players to go out in an adventuring party and 'cover all the bases'. Everything past the core classes lose versatility. Everyone becomes more and more inflexible by specializing so much. I have seen many groups fall for this very reason since 3.0, but it was far less of a problem in 2e or 1e. It is much easier to find gapping holes in a 3.5 party as a DM. That can be good if you are looking for weaknesses to exploit, but really irritating otherwise.