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View Full Version : ALIEN trilogy vs. Quadrilogy



Inquisitor Tremayne
07-24-2007, 10:13 AM
Alright. Lets get this debate started!

Personally I prefer the Trilogy. Alien Resurrection was terrible as far as being a part of the Alien continuity. Even though I love all the actors in the movie I couldn't bear to even consider this as part of the saga. Ripley died on Fury 161. Period. I don't care if she was cloned with Alien dna they still brought her back. Not good.

Don't even get me started on Aliens vs. Predator!

Skunkape
07-25-2007, 06:58 AM
Well, I thought they did a whole bunch of interesting things throughout the series, and enjoyed each movie, but if you really want to start nit-picking, how did an alien infect Ripley at the end of the 2nd movie/beginning of the 3rd?

After all, no aliens would have been able to make it onto the Sulaco, except the queen, which they brought along. As far as I could tell, she wasn't carrying an egg when she showed up on the landing platform of the atmo processor. She had already detached herself from her egg laying sack, so how did the egg get there?

That was the big problem I had with 3, well that and they killed off all of the survivors from 2 except Ripley.

Oh yeah and I thought that the face huggers only carried 1 baby alien! How did it infect Ripley and then infect the dog?

Inquisitor Tremayne
07-25-2007, 11:00 AM
Well, I thought they did a whole bunch of interesting things throughout the series, and enjoyed each movie, but if you really want to start nit-picking, how did an alien infect Ripley at the end of the 2nd movie/beginning of the 3rd?

After all, no aliens would have been able to make it onto the Sulaco, except the queen, which they brought along. As far as I could tell, she wasn't carrying an egg when she showed up on the landing platform of the atmo processor. She had already detached herself from her egg laying sack, so how did the egg get there?

That was the big problem I had with 3, well that and they killed off all of the survivors from 2 except Ripley.

Oh yeah and I thought that the face huggers only carried 1 baby alien! How did it infect Ripley and then infect the dog?

Ah! All true.

However, I have a problem with the fact that the Queen smuggled aboard the drop ship in the first place. If I can suspend by disbelief for that then I can suspend it to believe that she squeezed our one more "special" egg that was able to infect 2 beings instead of one.

Not to mention I have a problem with the fact that they changed some of the conceptual ideas about the Aliens from the 1st movie to the 2nd one in order to make the second one more of a military action movie but I can let that slide also.

What I can't suspend my disbelief over is a human/alien cloned hybrid in human for AND in Alien form AND an Alien queen that gives birth to probably the worst designed monster that I have ever seen on screen. Trust me I have seen some crappy monster movies but that monstrosity takes the cake! Seriously, they had the opportunity to create one of the best looking coolest monsters ever and they totally jacked it up! Hopefully AVP 2 will make up for it with the Alien/Predator hybrid.

Anyway, there are tons of plot holes in the Alien saga, about as much as the Star Wars saga also, but for the most part I can let them slide.

Skunkape
07-25-2007, 12:56 PM
My big hate about the 4th movie was the death scene of the hybrid.

Just in case anyone has not seen it! SPOILER ALERT!


It took forever to get that damn thing sucked out the window! I sat there cringing hoping it would stop SCREAMING!:D

Farcaster
07-25-2007, 01:49 PM
That was the big problem I had with 3, well that and they killed off all of the survivors from 2 except Ripley.

Well, they had to get rid of the girl technically, because it would have been more difficult to explain why she grew up while in cryofreeze.

Moritz
07-25-2007, 05:22 PM
At least AVP2 will be rated R.

Skunkape
07-26-2007, 08:38 AM
Well, they had to get rid of the girl technically, because it would have been more difficult to explain why she grew up while in cryofreeze.

True, but I really hate when a franchise changes the cannon as it were. It's a shame when one writer decides that they really like an idea and go and change something that the creator of the franchise had already decided. I know it happens with any story that has multiple writers, but with the Alien franchise, they went to far.

So did anyone else notice the apparent symbolism when Ripley died on Fury 161?

Inquisitor Tremayne
07-27-2007, 10:59 AM
At least AVP2 will be rated R.

YES! Thank god!!!!

What apparent symbolism are you talking about?

To me, Alien 3 ended the way the franchise should have ended, with the death of Ripley. Even the bit at the very end, that didn't fit at all, where the recording of her original message from the end of Alien, naming off the crew that died, was playing back, was somewhat touching.

Then to have her brought back as a clone/hybrid things was dumb. Weaver will ALWAYS be Ripley from the original trilogy no matter which Alien movie she is in.

Moritz
07-29-2007, 03:05 PM
PS: I liked 1 and 2. 3 and 4 were nice to see, fleshing out the world a little better. Even read that Aliens: Earth Hive book which was interesting. But 3 and 4 seemed to me that they were just going for more money. I'm of the apocalyptic sort, and would like to see a Aliens 5 where they are on the earth in that time period where they've wiped out most of the planet. Just like a future movie of the Terminator.

Skunkape
07-30-2007, 07:20 AM
YES! Thank god!!!!

What apparent symbolism are you talking about?

I'm talking about the way she's falling into the furnace with her feet together and arms stretched out to the side, slightly Christ like pose. Maybe I'm reading more into that part than is necessary, but she's saving the human race, being the sacrifical lamb, etc, etc.

I've never read any notes about that scene in the movie, but that's the way it appears to me.

Inquisitor Tremayne
07-30-2007, 07:57 AM
I'm talking about the way she's falling into the furnace with her feet together and arms stretched out to the side, slightly Christ like pose. Maybe I'm reading more into that part than is necessary, but she's saving the human race, being the sacrifical lamb, etc, etc.

I've never read any notes about that scene in the movie, but that's the way it appears to me.


Oh! Yeah! Of course! Thats what makes the 3rd one so final. A great end to the series. And ends sort of with hope.

On a side note, this is part of the reason I hate zombie movies, there is usually no hope at the end, everything is just sh*t.

Anyway, from an anarchistic point of view, the 4th one was necessary to offset the "holy" ending to the third.

I too was/am hoping for a final movie where Aliens have come to earth and destroyed everything. Throw predator in there too, why not!

PhishStyx
07-30-2007, 09:00 PM
I dunno, I watched 'em. 3 and 4 were ok, but really after the 2nd movie, they seemed like such money grabs to me that I just didn't give them as much of my attention as I suppose I could've.

And Aliens Vs. Predator was utterly and completely money grabbing crap. I just really hated that whole back-story mess they twisted both plots into to get that movie to work.

Inquisitor Tremayne
07-30-2007, 11:21 PM
Alien vs. predator I agree was crap. Massive let down.

I understand peoples arguments about 3 also and I agree with anyoe who says 4 was crap.

For me, the best one is the first one, Alien. Hands down. The second one is just a wee bit too action movie for me but Weaver's performance carries the movie all the way from beginning to end. I see the third one as getting back to the roots of the first one. It was more thriller less action-y.

Skunkape
07-31-2007, 07:26 AM
Alien vs. predator I agree was crap. Massive let down.

I understand peoples arguments about 3 also and I agree with anyoe who says 4 was crap.

For me, the best one is the first one, Alien. Hands down. The second one is just a wee bit too action movie for me but Weaver's performance carries the movie all the way from beginning to end. I see the third one as getting back to the roots of the first one. It was more thriller less action-y.

That's about my take on the set, except that I liked the second one a lot, course, I'm into action flicks, add Sci-Fi to it and well...

For some reason I kept hoping for more with AvP, but it never showed! My biggest problem with AvP was the fact that none of the Predators noticed that the only one who got out of the 'temple' was infected! In my opinion, they should have picked that up right away!

PhishStyx
07-31-2007, 11:29 AM
See, of the Alien series, I'd classify the first one as a horror movie, set in deep space sure, but still horror in much the same way as I'd say that Pitch Black is horror, yet Chronicles of Riddick is not.

In both cases, the first and 2nd movies are fine movies, but have very different goals in their making.

Moritz
07-31-2007, 03:09 PM
I just saw the second movie as 'expansion' on the story. In both cases, Riddick and Aliens. It's a good progression, more action, more content, more movie. Unlike Speed 1 and Speed 2.

AsmoTiC
08-01-2007, 12:34 PM
Just to answer a quick question. If you watch the beginning of Alien 3, when the camera is showing off the vacant interior of the Shulako. The camera pans by an egg stuck to a beam (near the mess hall). If you watch it carefully, you'll see the egg has a barcode, or tattoo type marking on it. Which leads you to assume the egg was put there after Aliens, or was on board the whole time.

Of course this only gives us one face hugger, still don't know where the second for Alien 3 comes from.

Inquisitor Tremayne
08-01-2007, 02:49 PM
Ah! Interesting. I never noticed that before. I'm going to rush home and look for it.

There was rumor of some such that the face hugger that implanted the embryo in Ripley, because it was a queen one, that it was special and could implant another embryo. I don't recall where I heard that from.

Moritz
08-01-2007, 02:53 PM
Wasn't there a listing somewhere that suggested the Aliens could undergo transformation into a queen if none were present? Maybe that was in one of the books I read.

Inquisitor Tremayne
08-01-2007, 02:54 PM
Yeah. I remember reading that too!

Skylon
08-01-2007, 03:57 PM
Trilogy? Quartet? Sorry folks I kinda pushed 3 and resurection out of my memory. There should have been a third to tie up some loose ends from the previous but the third they did was just tripe.

I don't want to compare it to the Godfather because while Godfather three didn't seem like a natural part of the trilogy (waaaaay too many new chartacters, for example) it was at least a very good movie in it's own rights.

Moritz
08-01-2007, 05:14 PM
I once had a VHS that had the Godfather Trilogy spliced together in chronological order. That and the same with Pulp Fiction.