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View Full Version : Monks, Brassknuckles made of special materials.



deaconabyss
01-08-2011, 11:17 AM
Since monks may use thier unarmed damage with brassknuckles, I suppose if they can have pairs made of alch silver and iron to overcome DR's?

wizarddog
01-08-2011, 04:48 PM
Alchemist Silver can only be applied to steel slashing and piercing weapons. So no silver brass knuckles.

Cold iron could be made into brass knuckles.

The brass Knuckles can also be enchanted and forged as Masterwork.

deaconabyss
01-09-2011, 09:33 AM
I should had said this was for pathfinder monks but I don't think it matters. In the rules under Alch Silver it never states you can't use the process on bludgeoning weapons. It does say slashing and piercing weapons get a -1 on damage. I assumed that was because the silvering doesn't hold an edge or point as well. I posted the question on paizo's message-board for further clarification thank you for the response. I took the cold iron description as a guide an arrow head can be made of cold iron but a quarterstaff can't the a mace-head could. Seeing brass-knuckles are all metal it's only logical to me that they should too.

On the paizo message boards they seem to gravitate towards the same conclusion. This is because the monk gets hosed on DR, unarmed damage, and special materials.

If you know an official forum where it says no bludgeoning weapons can be made of alch. silver "errata or otherwise" I would deeply appreciate a link.

wizarddog
01-09-2011, 11:38 PM
Silver, Alchemical
A complex process involving metallurgy and alchemy can bond silver to a weapon made of steel so that it bypasses the damage reduction of creatures such as lycanthropes.

On a successful attack with a silvered slashing or piercing weapon, the wielder takes a –1 penalty on the damage roll (with a minimum of 1 point of damage). The alchemical silvering process can't be applied to nonmetal items, and it doesn't work on rare metals such as adamantine, cold iron, and mithral.

Source:
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/special-materials

The reference contradicts itself by stating the metal needed(Steel) to make it work is steel while stating it doesn't work on any non metal or rare metals. My beef was that brass knuckles are not made of steel.

However, this is pretty much a nit-pick issue. If the DM allows for the creation of the item with special material, there is no game breaking reason not to allow it--fluff text be damn.

tesral
01-10-2011, 01:38 AM
Well just to be pedantic, if you make them from other than brass they are not "brass" knuckles anymore.

That said I would say why not? Any metal you can cast into the right shape would serve the purpose, and I would rule that if the material the knuckle assist is made of overcomes DR, being hit by it would over come DR. Slugging a werewolf with silverknuckles is going to leave a mark.

And you don't even need "alchemical" anything. You cast the device solid. The only thing you couldn't really get away with is gold which frankly you could deform gripping the knuckles too hard.


Silver, Alchemical
A complex process involving metallurgy and alchemy can bond silver to a weapon made of steel so that it bypasses the damage reduction of creatures such as lycanthropes.

On a successful attack with a silvered slashing or piercing weapon, the wielder takes a 1 penalty on the damage roll (with a minimum of 1 point of damage). The alchemical silvering process can't be applied to nonmetal items, and it doesn't work on rare metals such as adamantine, cold iron, and mithral.

And to give the rules an "oh come on" moment. The process is called "plating". there is nothing mystical about it. It should work on any metal, rare or otherwise. Chemical and ionic methods dating back to ancient times exist. When done to non metal objects it is called gilding, and it might require you start with gold to give you a base to plate with other metals. There are processes that could be used with Renaissance level technology that would plate or gild anything with any metal you can melt to the vapor point.

deaconabyss
01-14-2011, 07:23 AM
4d6b3

stldnder
01-21-2011, 11:24 AM
I should had said this was for pathfinder monks but I don't think it matters. In the rules under Alch Silver it never states you can't use the process on bludgeoning weapons. It does say slashing and piercing weapons get a -1 on damage. I assumed that was because the silvering doesn't hold an edge or point as well. I posted the question on paizo's message-board for further clarification thank you for the response. I took the cold iron description as a guide an arrow head can be made of cold iron but a quarterstaff can't the a mace-head could. Seeing brass-knuckles are all metal it's only logical to me that they should too.

On the paizo message boards they seem to gravitate towards the same conclusion. This is because the monk gets hosed on DR, unarmed damage, and special materials.

If you know an official forum where it says no bludgeoning weapons can be made of alch. silver "errata or otherwise" I would deeply appreciate a link.

Alchemical Silver may be applied to knuckles. Since they are bludgeoning weapons, they do not suffer the -1 damage penalty.

According to the Pathfinder RPG core book, mithral is treated as silver for purposes of overcoming DR. Also, I think the knuckles need to be enhanced with Ki Focus in order to allow the monk's special ki attacks to be used through the knuckles.

Tyrnd
01-27-2011, 02:26 PM
stldnder basically said what I was planning on saying myself. If you have the Ki Focus enchantment on your brass knuckles you should be able to overcome DR without having to use special material or high level enchantments (+3, +4, etc.) when you reach the appropriate level. But if the purpose of this was to overcome DR for a special encounter, like if you're going into a lair of werewolves, then I don't see the issue with making "brass" knuckles with other metals instead.

deaconabyss
01-28-2011, 09:34 AM
yeah I maybe could had said this was for a lvl one monk. Thanks for all the precious feedback guys.

Giasrhen
02-06-2011, 04:27 PM
Just two points. Cold rolled Iron has a low shatter point or break point ( no there are no game statistics for it) if you strike something really hard lets say a stone wall ( or a stone golem ) its going to shatter. next it has very little give if you strike something that doesnt give you are very likely to break a finger or two. there is a reason they made them out of brass. Silver should work just fine understanding of course that if you strike something really hard its shape will distort. not as much as lead or gold but definetly more than iron or steel.