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harmor
01-16-2010, 02:38 PM
How do you coax your 3.5 group to play Pathfinder?

cpljarhead
01-16-2010, 03:46 PM
id start adding in components of pathfinder into u 3.5 game. start with the little things and then start with npc's and finally bring in characters.

Arkhemedes
01-16-2010, 04:24 PM
Tell them the rules for combat maneuvers are much easier and characters get feats every other level instead one for every three, in addition to bonus feats (which means a feat every level for fighters). This is just for starters. Plus everything they like about about 3.5 - it's still there! What's not to like?

Richard Littles
01-16-2010, 04:27 PM
What about $500 per player?

Dark
01-16-2010, 05:24 PM
How do you coax you 3.5 group to play Pathfinder?
Let them play 4e? :laugh: j/k

Hoitash
01-16-2010, 09:11 PM
Alternate. Say "how about we do a short camapign in Pathfinder, so you see what its like firsthand, and if you don't like it we're done, but if you do, we can stick with it or switch between the two, I mean, we have all these 3.5 books, that cost thirty dollars each, and there are so. Many. Of. Them."

Sorry, that last point irks me. It would be cheaper to buy a cheap laptop then all those books, which I'll probably do. But I digress.

Mestemeah
01-16-2010, 09:55 PM
id start adding in components of pathfinder into u 3.5 game. start with the little things and then start with npc's and finally bring in characters.

I like this idea. But I would not "sneak" it in. Tell the group what you would like to do. Make sure they are okay with it so that you don't "ruffle any feathers" with big surprises. If you can manage handling the differences on your own to demo what is possible with Pathfinder, the players might see you are right about the improvement Pathfinder would be.

My two cents,
Meste

WhiteTiger
01-16-2010, 11:28 PM
you can always try whining, cajoling, threaten to leave the group, slash tires, blackmail, extortion, mass murder... whatever will work.. :biggrin: :shocked: :twitch:

seriously, though, If you know the rules. you should be able to do a quick 15 minute run through of the new CMB / CMD system to show the how grapple, trip and bull rush work in pathfinder and how you calculate each one. If they like that then have them try out the new skill list. If they like that then it should be a piece of cake after that. The only question is... are the other members of the group into power ramp-up.

Pathfinder characters are generally considered to be more powerful than 3.5.

wizarddog
01-17-2010, 02:42 PM
We exactly did not have a choice. The DM did not want to continue using 3.5 rules because the power creep that was happening with the wizard and cleric players (both good at optimizing). He wanted either to go core only, (which would not have resolved a thing) or try pathfinder

Of course we had some PrC, core classes not found in the Pathfinder book. Ultimately, our heros transformed from their original conception and some actually just remade new characters to make it work.

Skunkape
01-19-2010, 07:38 AM
Alternate. Say "how about we do a short camapign in Pathfinder, so you see what its like firsthand, and if you don't like it we're done, but if you do, we can stick with it or switch between the two, I mean, we have all these 3.5 books, that cost thirty dollars each, and there are so. Many. Of. Them."

Sorry, that last point irks me. It would be cheaper to buy a cheap laptop then all those books, which I'll probably do. But I digress.

You could also see if they'll play a one off/single adventure game to find out if they like the rules.

Swordnboard
01-19-2010, 04:44 PM
When we switched, I simply announced to my group that we were going to do it. They liked the change, and we never looked back (except to reference some of the additional sourcebooks :)). Conversion didn't take too long, and gameplay is similar and faster.

Jeffrywith1e
02-14-2010, 09:02 AM
As a player of 3.5 who wanted to move to Pathfinder, I offered to run a campaign in Pathfinder. Everyone agreed. My first time behind the screen (since the mid '90s).

WhiteTiger
02-14-2010, 07:27 PM
As a player of 3.5 who wanted to move to Pathfinder, I offered to run a campaign in Pathfinder. Everyone agreed. My first time behind the screen (since the mid '90s).


and ??? curious GM's want to know what others think... :confused:

Jeffrywith1e
02-14-2010, 10:04 PM
and ??? curious GM's want to know what others think... :confused:We've had two sessions so far. It's a bit awkward still as I'm finding my legs behind the screen. The game is familiar enough that things run as smooth as normal. One of the players is new to our group and completely new to 3e all together. His learning curve is overshadowing our learning Pathfinder. We haven't had much with Combat Maneuvers yet. One character is using poisons which has opened up the differences in the rules there. Here's where we are with that if you're interested...



Poisons are looking like a big part of our campaign. So lets establish some rules. Pathfinder rules say this about poisions:

types: Contact, Ingested, Inhaled, Injury

So far we've only used injury...
1) Poison on a weapon cannot be delivered via touch since the weapon has to cut the skin.
2) When the victim makes his initial fort save against the poison, it removes that poison from the weapon regardless whether the victim made his fort save.
3) Multiple hits by the same poison only stack for extending duration - no further 'initial saves' are needed, only 'frequency saves'.
4) Any creature that makes its 'frequency save' is cured of all the same poison - even from multiple hits.
5) Every application of poison forces a 5% chance of poisoning one's self.
6) Rolling a 'natural one' on an attack with poison results in poisoning one's self.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering---final/afflictions---final#TOC...

What's not covered by Pathfinder (yet) is application on weapons. So we must default to the D&D 3.5 rules:

D&D 3.5 rules:
1) Application of poison on a weapon only lasts for 10 minutes.
2) "It is not possible to apply poison to any weapon in less than 1 dose."
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#poison

So we're going to go with one dose per dart. We're on the Council of Thieves Adventure Path which I think is fantastic so far.

Zethallon
02-19-2010, 09:24 PM
Honestly, it wasn't a hard sell. Some of the players were already looking at Pathfinder and the GM was willing to convert the campaign over. One thing that was very nice was Paizo puts together a terrific conversion guide from their web site that you can get for free just for signing up. I can tell you it was less painful then going from 3.0 to 3.5.

Hamenopi
02-25-2010, 09:10 AM
Same here with Jeff. I wanted to GM again after a long hiatus with the group I'm currently in. I was really looking at Warhammer fantasy when someone mentioned Pathfinder. Looked into it and I was sold. That's not to say that there isn't underlying warhammer tones in my campaign.

So last night I set my party of 8 lvl 1 adventurers against a lvl 3 kobold druid, a lvl 1 kobold fighter, a lvl 1 kobold adept (which ended up being useless), and 3 lvl 1 kobold warriors.

APL 2 vs. CR 4. Let me preface this by saying I have 3 players with ADHD who I usually have to wrangle with at time to keep their focus in my friend's 3.5 campaign. 2 hour long match and we all thought it wasn't even a half hour in length. Half the table screaming oh my god half the time at the Kobold Tactics.

Setting: Medium dense forest. Kobold fighter behind cover, shooting at the party, drawing them into an ambush. Druid and vermin companion hidden in woods with fog cloud prepared. Adept and 3 warriors hiding further back to bring up the rear. Adept cast sleep that landed on mainly elves ( he didn't know he was going to be fighting elves when we woke up).

TheYeti1775
02-25-2010, 01:41 PM
Buy them each a copy of the Core Pathfinder book.

I did that with my group when I wanted to try DM'ing a D20 setting with them.
Bought them each (well the couple got one copy) a copy of the setting for a Christmas present that year.

Zethallon
02-26-2010, 07:40 AM
[quote=TheYeti1775;133214]Buy them each a copy of the Core Pathfinder book.quote]

Wow, even if you bought them the *.pdf, that's a very generous gift from the GM. I would gladly play in your group any day. :D

TheYeti1775
02-26-2010, 10:14 AM
[quote=TheYeti1775;133214]Buy them each a copy of the Core Pathfinder book.quote]

Wow, even if you bought them the *.pdf, that's a very generous gift from the GM. I would gladly play in your group any day. :D
Well it wasn't a well known setting, and I was introduced to it by it's author.
I liked it a lot, and wanted to share it with them.

We were all friends outside the game as well and exchanged gifts for Christmas and Bday's as well. So it wasn't out of character for us.

Xanatheus
03-05-2010, 07:25 PM
We've added the skills to our 3.5 characters. So far there are no complaints. Casting Defensively take a little getting used to though.

DireMosquito
03-14-2010, 06:11 AM
I missed the first half of the convo, so excuse me if I repeat...

We've just made the switch from 3.5 to PF. Everyone is happy. Nobody would have it any other way. In brief, I think the sales pitch would be that Pathfinder takes a decent but clumsy mechanic in 3.5 and sands off all the rough edges to result in a game system that has all the advantages and familiarity of 3.5 with the balance that the game needed.

At a base level, all the players really need to do is read the pages relating to their class and alter their feat progression. All the DM really needs to do is account for the new CMB mechanic and continue to do things just the same - even continue to use the ol' MMs and modules if desired. Also note the changes made to skills.

You can add as little or as much of the new mechanic as you want as the two are completely compatible (even if the 3.5 core classes are underpowered when compared to both PF core classes and 3.5 splatbooks). Not that I'd recommend it, but you could even have a PF and 3.5 character running side by side without major issues apart from the 3.5 player wanting to upgrade before too long.

If you don't want to spend any cash, maybe get the DM a copy of the core book and have the players access the online system reference document until they take the plunge.

UURich
04-06-2010, 10:04 PM
I'd have to agree with offering out the idea to run a PF game and seeing how it goes over. We had a GM in our group and the game was lagging on consecutive months and it was time for me to start preparing something. He was running a AD&D 2E campaign at the time and I had two 7th Sea books that I just got and I threw it out there. They didn't play anything else for over eight years and it took me going out on a military deployment for the rest of the group to do something else.

Inserting some of the rules as you're going along in your current campaign is a way to get them used to the new system but it doesn't do much if you're in an established campaign world (Forgotten Realms, Greyhawk, etc.) unless converting characters is easy enough to do. This is my second day looking at PF myself so I'm speaking in theories. I usually build my worlds from scratch and go from there.

I know most of our members were pretty receptive with changing things up a little if I had one-on-one conversations with them but that's the kind of person I am. Keeping the conversation and getting each opinion matters to them and weighing any real heavy dissenters will have to be something you'll have to take into consideration.

deathboy
04-23-2010, 02:59 AM
My group went willingly. we were playing Rise of the Runelords before the switch and then started Curse of the Crimson Throne under Beta rules. We finally switched over to PRPG when it came out at GenCon. (God lugging around 6 copies in line SUCKED.) Add to it PFS and thus everyone has been sold. There has been no regrets.

UURich
04-23-2010, 05:59 AM
Good job lugging six copies of PathFinder through the line. It looks like one heck of a book. I'm still stuck with the PDF because funds are tight and I can probably print the pages that I need and make a "players handbook" if I need something at the table.

d-_-b
06-24-2010, 06:22 PM
I have just bought the core rules this week after having heard so many great things about pathfinder and I must say I love what Paizo has done to 3.5. None of my players know about pathfinder but I simply plan to inform them that when the current story arch ends we are going to start over at lvl 1 with new characters in a new world with slightly better rules. As this story arch should last us into september they'll have some time to mull over it.

emirikol
07-02-2010, 11:53 AM
I like this topic :)
Here's how you do it:
1. Tell them that the character classes are slightly more powerful
2. Tell them that you're going to be running it (because it will prevent DM burnout having all those good scenarios at your fingertips)

That's about it ;)

jh

Koushiro
07-02-2010, 11:43 PM
You can remind them that all of their 3.5 material is completely backwards compatible. It isn't the most horrific of changes, just like someone said before. The switch from 3.0 to 3.5 was a lot more complicated.

Plus the Pathfinder RPG was play tested by the gamers themselves for almost a year, so a lot of the improvements were a direct result of player feedback.

TheDarkestOfAngels
07-15-2010, 02:00 AM
How do you coax your 3.5 group to play Pathfinder?

It took one action and one sentence with my group to convert.
Once two or so of our group had thumbed through the book, we told the others that it was D&D 3.5, only better.

Some examples are cited (changes in class design, the way favored classes work, skills, etc). Heck, the overall value of the pathfinder book is enormously superior to the value you get from the 4e books - 50$ for the equivelent of two books in one with better art, unique (not taken from the previous edition's books) art, and an overall improvement of the layout and overall look of the book is absolutely stunning.

I don't mean to sound like a paizo whore, but compared to wizards of the coast these days, their work on the pathfinder core rulebook and bestiary is absolutely supurb.

That explaination had everyone designing characters within the hour and we managed to coax one of my friends to run a game, since he hadn't done so yet.

Guardian
07-21-2010, 10:50 PM
Let them play 4e? :laugh: j/k

Actually....this IS how our table got convinced to play Pathfinder. We gave 4th a shot and thought it was absolute garbage (I felt they did get three things right). We then went to Pathfinder and immediately jumped on board.

When 3rd Ed came out (3.5 to be exact), I felt the game became way too imbalanced around levels 10-12.
Looking at Pathfinder made me want to run 3rd again.

Koushiro
07-22-2010, 12:05 PM
Actually....this IS how our table got convinced to play Pathfinder.

About the same for my table too actually, the Pathfinder Beta book had just come out about the same time we were getting bored with 4e. Good timing on Paizo's part for that now that I think about it.