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cigamnogard
09-14-2009, 07:35 PM
Where would I find stats on a Dire Heavy Warhorse?

DMMike
09-15-2009, 06:46 PM
Just advance a heavy warhorse 5 levels of Animal, and be sure to adjust the stats for a bump in size (Large to Huge).

Or take the lazy route and increase all numbers by 5.

cigamnogard
09-15-2009, 07:19 PM
Thanks but I was hoping it would be in a MM some where.
--- Merged from Double Post ---
I have discovered that the Dire Horse is in MM2 on page 75. However, that is all I have been able to discover! Does anyone have the stats on it from page 75?

Handsomethrowrug
09-16-2009, 12:10 AM
Dire Horse
Large Animal
Hit Dice: 8d8+48 (84 hp)
Initiative: +1
Speed: 60 ft.
AC: 16 (-1 size, +1 Dex, +6 natural), touch 10, flat-footed 15
Attacks: 2 hooves, +11 melee and bite +6 melee
Damage: Hoof 1d6+6, bite 1d4+3
Face/Reach: 5 ft. by 10 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: --
Special Qualities: Low-light vision, scent
Saves: Fort +12, Ref +7, Will +8
Abilities: Str 22, Dex 13, Con 22, Int 2, Wis 15, Cha 11
Skills: Listen +8, Spot +8
Climate/Terrain: Any land
Organization: Solitary or herd (6-30)
Challenge Rating: 4
Treasure: None
Alignment: Always neutral
Advancement: 9-16 HD (Large); 17-24 HD (Huge)


But that's just a dire horse. Not a dire heavy warhorse. :P

shilar
09-16-2009, 01:46 AM
I don't have my MM right now but isn't there a dire animal template in it. Just apply the template to the heavy warhorse and it's all set.

cigamnogard
09-16-2009, 04:05 PM
I don't have my MM right now but isn't there a dire animal template in it. Just apply the template to the heavy warhorse and it's all set.
That would be great but I have not seen any such template.
--- Merged from Double Post ---



But that's just a dire horse. Not a dire heavy warhorse. :P

Right but with that info I can now figure out the difference ;)

Handsomethrowrug
09-16-2009, 05:15 PM
If I remember correctly, and I very well might not be, there was a Dire Animal template in 3.0, but it was removed in 3.5 due to inconsistencies with the animals.

Then again, I might just be thinking of the legendary animal template in MM2.

cigamnogard
09-16-2009, 06:40 PM
Dire Horse
Large Animal

But that's just a dire horse. Not a dire heavy warhorse. :P
Wait it's just a large animal? But it is already large should it not be huge?
What the heck?

Handsomethrowrug
09-16-2009, 09:14 PM
*shrugs*

I wrote it word for word from my MM3.5. Guess you have to advance it to 17HD to make it huge.

cigamnogard
09-17-2009, 04:38 PM
Yes-Very strange...

Crossroads_Wanderer
09-18-2009, 11:17 PM
There was a dire horse in the Masters of the Wild splat book. I'm guessing that's what they based the 3.5 MMII version off of. I always thought it was strange that they were large, too, especially since the dire elk right next to it was huge.

cigamnogard
09-21-2009, 05:55 PM
There was a dire horse in the Masters of the Wild splat book. I'm guessing that's what they based the 3.5 MMII version off of. I always thought it was strange that they were large, too, especially since the dire elk right next to it was huge.

Really off eh?

Dimthar
09-21-2009, 07:42 PM
I just hope the "Dire Warhorse" is for the halfling.

What is the use of such a big beast in a Forest? That type of animal sounds like a "Plains" creature.

cigamnogard
09-24-2009, 04:39 PM
Actually for an Ogre or a Druegar

nijineko
09-24-2009, 06:20 PM
well, druegar is almost as good as being for a halfling...

cigamnogard
09-25-2009, 02:52 PM
Except when it enlarges...Hence the need for a dire horse

d-_-b
10-14-2009, 11:45 AM
I don't really see the need for a warhorse to be "dire". I would simply advance a warhorse the appropriate levels in relation to the character who rides it and be done with it.

If you need a mount for an Ogre you might want to think of using another creature as a mount. This would also make for a more exotic and hence memorable character. Alternatively accept that some creatures are just not meant to be mounted -after all, what would the Hulk or Godzilla ride?
--- Merged from Double Post ---
Alternatively you could get an item, such as a saddle, which is enchanted with a continuous effect that enlarges a regular heavy warhorse. It would cost you a pretty penny, though...

spl lvl x cstr lvl x 1000gp x 1,5 for unusual item (I think)

Tibrand
10-14-2009, 04:57 PM
Is it even possible that a warhorse can be dire?
As the warhorse is a product by civilization, conceived for generation to fit in the needs of the military forces of "that time".

And, then english is second languade BUT, isnt a dire animal like a dire horse actually a "wild or untamed" animal or horse?

cigamnogard
10-14-2009, 06:32 PM
I don't really see the need for a warhorse to be "dire". I would simply advance a warhorse the appropriate levels in relation to the character who rides it and be done with it.



Except that you cannot advance a warhorse - see MMI page 273
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Is it even possible that a warhorse can be dire?
As the warhorse is a product by civilization, conceived for generation to fit in the needs of the military forces of "that time".

And, then english is second languade BUT, isnt a dire animal like a dire horse actually a "wild or untamed" animal or horse?

There are lots of wild horses today - in real life...so, I guess I do not get your point:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wild_horse
--- Merged from Double Post ---



spl lvl x cstr lvl x 1000gp x 1,5 for unusual item (I think)

Now this might be possible - I will have to look into it...

Tibrand
10-14-2009, 06:50 PM
the difference between a wild or dire horse and a warhorse is that the warhorse is a product of the society, after generations of breading.
The warhorse is not a wild animal people found in the woods and started taming, selected breading had made it that big.

cigamnogard
10-14-2009, 07:01 PM
the difference between a wild or dire horse and a warhorse is that the warhorse is a product of the society, after generations of breading.
The warhorse is not a wild animal people found in the woods and started taming, selected breading had made it that big.

As English is a second languge - here is a defination:
Main Entry: dire
Function: adjective
Inflected Form(s): dir·er; dir·est
Etymology: Latin dirus; akin to Greek deinos terrifying, Sanskrit dveṣṭi he hates
Date: 1565
1 a : exciting horror <dire suffering> b : dismal (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/dismal), oppressive (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/oppressive) <dire days>
2 : warning of disaster <a dire forecast>
3 a : desperately urgent <dire need> b : extreme (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/extreme) <dire poverty>
— dire·ly adverb
— dire·ness noun

Tibrand
10-14-2009, 07:23 PM
aha so dire is more similar to the word large then wild?
Then i will take a step back in my argumentation.

d-_-b
10-15-2009, 03:22 AM
I'd still rule that, as Tibrand noted, a warhorse is trained for war by man and a product of generations of breeding for size, strength and discipline and can as such not be a horrifying product of nature at its most extreme. It is in effect a tame animal and you can no more have a dire warhorse than could you a dire pudel

Crossroads_Wanderer
10-15-2009, 07:33 AM
From my understanding, dire refers to a prehistoric holdover. Animals were often a lot larger in prehistoric times, so the idea of dire animals is probably borrowed from that concept. Technically, most animals cannot be dire scientifically speaking because they didn't exist as they are now in prehistoric times.

Because it doesn't make sense in the prehistoric sense, I usually think of dire animals as an animal that has been bred from powerful wild animals for generations, and pops up as sort of a fluke of nature, or potentially by the intention of the nature deties to have a powerful leader/protector animal for that ecosystem.

tesral
10-15-2009, 11:01 AM
As English is a second language - here is a definition: Main Entry: dire Function: adjective



From my understanding, dire refers to a prehistoric holdover. Animals were often a lot larger in prehistoric times, so the idea of dire animals is probably borrowed from that concept. Technically, most animals cannot be dire scientifically speaking because they didn't exist as they are now in prehistoric times.

And since when as D&D been beholden to the dictionary (or reality) for word definitions? "Cohort" anyone. What was wrong with the perfectly good "henchman"? How about the size categories. "That rat is huge", is it a really big rat or a 'huge' rat?"

I suppose you could have a dire horse. The spikes growing out of its back would make the saddle really uncomfortable. Its tendency to gore the other horses and random people would make it unpopular.

I would either stipulate a larger breed of horse or take the suggestion of using a different beast for riding.

I have two breeds of horse larger than "Heavy":

The Super Heavy draft horse stands 21 to 23 hands tall. Add a hit die, it can haul more and is too big to ride (unless you have the above problem)

The Saurio Horse is a magical breed standing 35 hands high. they are rare, and used by the Saurio (http://www.penandpapergames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7092), a half dragon race on my world. Saurio average 13 foot tall. Twice the size and eight times the weight of the average horse they have hooves the size of manhole covers and bones like ivory. 12 hit dice, d12 on the hoof attack and so forth. That might be a bit too large.

cigamnogard
10-15-2009, 08:03 PM
Do you have stats on them?

TheYeti1775
10-16-2009, 08:56 AM
Why not use the Dire Template and just call it something else.

Or just use page 291 in the Monster Manual I, Tables 4-2 & 4-3.
4-2 Changes to Statistics by Size
Large to Huge +8 Str; -2 Dex; +4 Con; +3 Nat Armor; -1 to Attack & AC

4-3 Increased Damage by Size

Just use those charts to Increase it's Hit Dice and Size till you get something that fits your Campaign World.

Something like:
Slysdale Ponies
These 'ponies' of the giants were breed in the wild by the smaller of the Giants for their much feared mounted calvaries of bygone ages. Many of these giant horses escaped during the wars, either set loose by enemies of the giants or wandered away from their fallen riders.
Many found their way to the Slysdale valley, where the locals (insert race of whatever here) used them for beasts of burden and to toil their farms. Over the centuries there has been several breeds that came from the Slysdale Ponies, the most famous of which in future years would pull a Red Wagon full of Beer. :D
But several breeders kept a line of them true, knowing their worth as calvary. Some are even rumored to have giant contacts to keep fresh breeding stock.

Feel free to use it, if it's published just give me a copy and a contributor line.
If it is already done before, sorry just came with it off the top of my head while sitting here reading it.
Heck ya got a few plot hook lines out of that little bit I wrote, a market where they wouldn't think it's an unusual request for saddles/harness of that nature, and a new location on the map to throw where you like.

tesral
10-16-2009, 10:41 AM
Do you have stats on them?

Sauroi Horse
Size/Type: Huge Animal
Hit Dice:12d8+48
Initiative:+0
Speed:100 ft. (20 squares)
Armor Class:14 (-2 size, +0 Dex, +6 natural), touch 14, flat-footed 14
Base Attack/Grapple:+9/+16
Attack:Hoof +14 melee (1d8+7*)
Full Attack:2 hooves +14 melee (1d8+7*)
Space/Reach:15 ft./10 ft.
Special Attacks:—
Special Qualities:Low-light vision, scent
Saves:Fort +10, Ref +6, Will +4
Abilities:Str 24, Dex 11, Con 19, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 6
Skills:Listen +4, Spot +4
Feats: Endurance, Run
Environment:Temperate plains
Organization:Domesticated (Herd)
Advancement:—
Level Adjustment:—

Sauroi Horses were created for the Sauroi race to ride. They are magically created animals, but have no inherent magic. The average Sauroi horse stands 11 foot at the shoulder. They weight in at an average of 3 tons. Sauroi horses can carry or pull three times the load that the average draft horse can manage.

The average Sauroi horse is of an moderate and easy going temperament. They do not tend to react well to small creatures (Humans) pulling at them. It takes something like a Sauroi or a giant to get and hold their respect.

Unlike average horses the Sauroi horse is not fearful of predators. Their reaction to attempted predation is to attack. This will put off all but the largest and most determined predators.

Unlike normal horses Sauroi horses have a gestation of 18 months. They follow most other horsey behaviors.

http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com/fantasy/Graphics/horsey.jpg

cigamnogard
10-16-2009, 05:06 PM
Why not use the Dire Template and just call it something else.

Or just use page 291 in the Monster Manual I, Tables 4-2 & 4-3.
4-2 Changes to Statistics by Size
Large to Huge +8 Str; -2 Dex; +4 Con; +3 Nat Armor; -1 to Attack & AC

4-3 Increased Damage by Size

Just use those charts to Increase it's Hit Dice and Size till you get something that fits your Campaign World.


YES! Why did I not see this before - thanks!
--- Merged from Double Post ---

Sauroi Horse
Size/Type: Huge Animal


Unlike normal horses Sauroi horses have a gestation of 18 months. They follow most other horsey behaviors.


Nice trade off! Thanks posting this.

DMMike
10-16-2009, 10:33 PM
I'm onboard with the breeding problem of the dire horse; dire creatures are the feral, undomesticated ancestors that were never hunted to extinction. The only creatures that survived the dawn of humans learning to hunt big game were the creatures that learned to be afraid of humans.

So, how does this explain the dire weasel? Um... it doesn't. But at least in D&D, there are regions of land untouched by civilization.

The point is that a dire horse, if you can find one, is probably not any easier to ride than a dire wolf. (I have pity on anyone trying to ride a dire wolf) I was trying to figure out what an ogre would ride the other day too, d-b. Best I could come up with, as realistic as possible, was an elephant. Because who has enough food to breed dire horses, when you can just kidnap an elephant, which has already learned to be afraid of people (or at least be tamable).

Technically, an ogre mount has to be of Huge size, and, darn it, there's not a whole lot of huge dire animals (at least in my MM1). Time to reach into Final Fantasy II and stat out the Behemoth...

d-_-b
10-17-2009, 05:38 AM
How about adapting a large animal such as a Rhino or an Elephant for riding. What it ultimately comes down to is the Heavy Warhorse's insufficient strength of 18 when it comes to carrying the considerable bulk of an Ogre. A base Rhino has a strength of 26 while an Elephant has 30. They both have considerable more HD than their equestrian counterparts and adapting one for war would be a cool and memorable twist of events.

There is NO rules that stipulate that a mount HAS to be at least a size category larger than its rider. While most horses are large creatures Ponies and Donkeys are both medium creatures AND rideable by medium creatures, albeit less gracefully so in comparison.

cigamnogard
10-19-2009, 03:25 PM
True enough but have you ever seen a pony or a donkey ridden by a full grown man...it is comical.

d-_-b
10-19-2009, 05:56 PM
Even so, an Ogre barreling down on you astride a Rhino would be anything but comical.

Forget horses and go with something else. Sure it takes some imagination and a bit of goodwill from the DM but it should be easy to adapt almost any suitable creature as a mount.

cigamnogard
10-19-2009, 08:17 PM
Even so, an Ogre barreling down on you astride a Rhino would be anything but comical.



Very true!

Pushkins
11-02-2009, 03:39 AM
Few issues with this.

#1 Dire Template is only to be put on natural creatures, meaning bears, rats, rabbits, hawks, etc... not magical beasts

#2 the Dire template adds only 1 size catagory jump to medium creatures

#3 As DM Mike said, these are ancient ansestors of the creatures, larger and more primative than the normal variety. And the fear of Man ( humanoid) would be inborn to any species that survived this long

I don't think Dire can breed as well, I maybe mistaken but I think it is a throw back of a fluke of birth, like legendary, or even paragon for that matter. An oddity of Birth

Any Mount must be 1 size catagory larger than the creature riding it, and ideally have an intellegence of 3 or less.

Ogres for one would NOT have mounts to begin with, they are numbskulls, evil, beings of low intellect. They find humor in rending things or the face a wizard makes just before his arms pop out of socket. Riding something of close intellegence to themselves would not go over well

d-_-b
11-02-2009, 03:23 PM
Any Mount must be 1 size catagory larger than the creature riding it, and ideally have an intellegence of 3 or less.

As far as I know there is no rule circumscribing a relation between a rider and his/her mount. I'm fairly sure that I am right in my assumption, given the fact that there are a lot of medium sized mounts. If I'm wrong I'd appreciate if you could refer me to a book and page number:)

cigamnogard
11-02-2009, 06:01 PM
Ogres for one would NOT have mounts to begin with, they are numbskulls, evil, beings of low intellect.

Not in Eberron.
--- Merged from Double Post ---

As far as I know there is no rule circumscribing a relation between a rider and his/her mount. I'm fairly sure that I am right in my assumption, given the fact that there are a lot of medium sized mounts. If I'm wrong I'd appreciate if you could refer me to a book and page number:)
Yes, please - looking for this rule as well.

Pushkins
11-03-2009, 03:15 AM
The thought of mounts being one size large may or may not be "written" in a book

However there is the implied need that a mount be able to bear the load of it's rider.

Based on light horses ( large size) they carry medium sized men, mounts of equal size need an large str and cons, to endure carring the riders.

I am not aware of any medium size mounts for any medium sized creatures, and if so they are "traditional" mounts able to bear rider and gear, or even just rider for any distance or range

And I do not play Eberron. I can see the Ogre Magi as an intellegent being, so if that is where that comes from ok, to me however these are two distinctive races

d-_-b
11-03-2009, 04:41 AM
Ponies and Donkeys are both medium mounts and eligible choices for a medium character. It is purely a question of the mount being sufficiently strong to carry the weight of it's rider and his/her gear. As mounts are subject to the same rules as characters regarding travel and fatigue to be effective they must be strong enough to endure carrying their load during extended traveling to be of practical use.

Pushkins
11-04-2009, 10:25 AM
Donkeys, Llamas and Ponies may all be Medium sized, but I don't think a fighter would be able to wear full armor and charge in to battle on his a$$, these are pack animals, able to bear loads of stuff, not ideal for a rider unless going into a canyon, where the animal's surefootedness is useful. or traveling long distances that would tire a person walking, however these animals aren't going to get you there in record speeds as well

Seems to only stress the point that the size needs to be larger, especially in the circumstance of an ogre riding one, most likely the ogre is looking to ride an animal into battle not into a canyon.

Of course battle ready mounts also need morale and able to handle the stress of battle not only on their physical needs, but also mentally

d-_-b
11-04-2009, 11:18 AM
A this point, Pushkins -and I mean no offense by asking; how familiar are you with the rules regarding weight allowance in D&D?

Firstly: The reason a pony or a donkey would be a poor choice of mount for a fully armed warrior is simply that it does not have the strength to carry him or her, NOT because he would look silly riding such a small mount. The party Wizard or Rogue, however, would likely be fine with this choice of mount as they would probably be travelling fairly light and not be fighting from their mount.
Secondly: Yes a mount need to be trained and disciplined for battle, hence warhorses and warponies. No one in their right mind would expend the considerable effort it takes to breed and train an animal of an inferior race for war, hence no wardonkeys or warlamas.

In the campaign I'm currently running we actually had an instance where not even a heavy warhorse had sufficient strength to carry the character fully armed into battle as his total weight exceeded 300lbs.

I do recognize that table 9-2 in PHB states that a larger creature has an easier time carrying heavy weights. This, however, does not mean that a medium creature should not be able to carry a medium sized rider as long as it is sufficiently strong.

Sascha
11-05-2009, 12:02 PM
Nothing to add, really, but ...

... warlamas ...

... sound awesome. A cavalry of Inca- or Mapuche-style warriors, pouring out of the mountains to the battle-bleats of their mounts~

Back to topic; sorry for the disturbance ;)

tesral
11-05-2009, 12:25 PM
Llamas cannopt carry a man. Too small. Haflings on the other hand.

Might I refer people to Gaming the Horse. (http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com/fantasy/horse_chart.html) System free gaming information on horses by someone that knows horses.

Pushkins
11-05-2009, 02:39 PM
how familiar are you with the rules regarding weight allowance in D&D?....

I'd say I am familiar, not well versed but familiar enough, And Yes strength does play an important role

An Ostrich is a large creature but by no means strong enough to serve as a valuable mount.

The point of size is exactly what you refered to , that large creatures generally have an easier time bearing heavier weights. As a matter of logic two animals of the same type, one being a size larger than the other, the larger one has more strength.

the main reason of this thread was to discuss a viable mount for an ogre, which all in all basically makes a very difficult case for one

d-_-b
11-05-2009, 07:23 PM
the main reason of this thread was to discuss a viable mount for an ogre, which all in all basically makes a very difficult case for one

True enough:)

I'd say an Elephant trained for war -otherwise forget it. Ogres should/would not be mounted anyway.

As for the Dire discussion regarding warhorses I have a suggestion. Insofar as the DM agree one might choose to regard the heavy warhorse listed in Monster Manual as an average heavy warhorse and then make an exceptional heavy warhorse available to the players. Paladins in a sense already enjoy this benefit since they can level up their celestial mounts and while I'm certainly not suggesting that all characters should be able to do this and thus devaluing the paladin class feature it would make sense to make a stronger and faster animal available to players for a price, like a master worked weapon or an up-rated composite bow.

cigamnogard
11-06-2009, 07:55 PM
True enough:)

I'd say an Elephant trained for war -otherwise forget it. Ogres should/would not be mounted anyway.

As for the Dire discussion regarding warhorses I have a suggestion. Insofar as the DM agree one might choose to regard the heavy warhorse listed in Monster Manual as an average heavy warhorse and then make an exceptional heavy warhorse available to the players. Paladins in a sense already enjoy this benefit since they can level up their celestial mounts and while I'm certainly not suggesting that all characters should be able to do this and thus devaluing the paladin class feature it would make sense to make a stronger and faster animal available to players for a price, like a master worked weapon or an up-rated composite bow.

Interesting idea.

d-_-b
11-07-2009, 09:44 AM
The other alternative would be to deck out your mount with a magical barding with the Easy Travel enhancement from Magic Item Comp. thereby letting the poor animal carry up to a medium load as were it a light one AND letting it travel for 10 hours straight before it had to start rolling dice for fatigue.

tesral
11-07-2009, 11:48 AM
The other alternative would be to deck out your mount with a magical barding with the Easy Travel enhancement from Magic Item Comp. thereby letting the poor animal carry up to a medium load as were it a light one AND letting it travel for 10 hours straight before it had to start rolling dice for fatigue.

Bah! D&D fatigue rules are abusive. I've been hiking with a full pack. 8 hours and start rolling dice is frankly, well abusive. But that is a different subject.

d-_-b
11-07-2009, 02:42 PM
I'm not sure I'd agree that the fatigue rules are abusive. To walk 8 hours day after day after day is tiring even if you have the endurance feat. At the end of the day there needs to be a system in place which regulates and limits travel so that things such as distance, terrain and time crunch matters in say a pursuit. I think the mechanics that are in place work as well as can be expected.

Anyway the reason I brought up Easy Travel is the ability to carry a medium load as were it a light.
--- Merged from Double Post ---
On top of that I'll promise you that the average city dweller will have a hard time walking 8 hours a day with just 40 lb. on his/her shoulders.

tesral
11-08-2009, 10:46 PM
I
On top of that I'll promise you that the average city dweller will have a hard time walking 8 hours a day with just 40 lb. on his/her shoulders.

Yo, been there, done that. Backpacking was a hobby before I messed up my back. A properly balanced load is not much load at all. And that was over Mountains, not just a flat trail. One reason I find the rules too stiff.

cigamnogard
11-09-2009, 05:24 PM
Hmmm...I have carried a pack or two in my cadet and military days. I remember being sore and tired at the end of the day. Guess the D&D worlds and I are just a bunch of wimps. However, my family and I raised quarter horses so after riding all day I also remeber being pretty sore and tired too...man, I guess I am a wimp!

tesral
11-09-2009, 05:57 PM
Hmmm...I have carried a pack or two in my cadet and military days. I remember being sore and tired at the end of the day. Guess the D&D worlds and I are just a bunch of wimps. However, my family and I raised quarter horses so after riding all day I also remeber being pretty sore and tired too...man, I guess I am a wimp!

The Military does not use proper frame packs. it makes a hell of a difference When the load is carried on your hips. You really had to be careful how much you loaded in those packs. It was easy to overload yourself. I also walked the world over as a young man. I thought nothing of walking several miles to get where I wanted to be. And I'm a city boy.

To defend the military a bit, a properly fitting frame pack is not something that is easy to do anything but walk it. To tie a shoe you have ot undo the belt, bend over, tie the shoe, shift the pack back in to position straighten the belt and retighten the shoulder straps.

However my current character Rapheal carries a Hewart's handy haversack. Hardly a heavy load.

d-_-b
11-09-2009, 06:14 PM
8 hours travel under favorable for a human wearing no armor and carrying a light load is 24 miles! That is 24 miles of continuous walking without modern footwear and without a "proper frame pack". Even with no load at all it would be a real challenge for most people. Doing it for days on end would break most of them. The only justifiable reason adventurers are able to do this is that they are exceptional individuals.

cigamnogard
11-09-2009, 07:19 PM
Which is why I want the the dire/whatever heavy warehorses for my Ogre Guard.

d-_-b
11-10-2009, 11:47 AM
Why not a war elephant? That would be SO cool! I want one myself.

Pushkins
11-10-2009, 01:50 PM
I agree, go with the war elephant

cigamnogard
11-10-2009, 07:12 PM
Ah, but now you have a large target on the battlefield plus the feed would be insane to account for. Still you are right it would be cool...

tesral
11-10-2009, 08:39 PM
8 hours travel under favorable for a human wearing no armor and carrying a light load is 24 miles! That is 24 miles of continuous walking without modern footwear and without a "proper frame pack". Even with no load at all it would be a real challenge for most people. Doing it for days on end would break most of them. The only justifiable reason adventurers are able to do this is that they are exceptional individuals.

Hooves, he doesn't need footwear.

Walking is what humans do best. As long as the surface is not unyielding barefoot is fine, if barefoot is what you are use to. Shoes of any kind are a recent invention in the history of man. We walked all over the planet.

As A kid, I walked, I biked, I used my legs. Eight hours walking was no real effort. I used my legs. To people that live in a world where shanks mare is how you travel walking again, is not going to be exceptional effort. We have gotten an idea of what can be done from people that don't walk day in and day out.

We are soft. People in the fantasy world would not be. Manual labor is how things would be done, walking is how you would get there.

Consider the War elephant. Unless you specify some fantasy style creature I think that is your best bet. Ogres being large creatures would see Elephants and or Rhinos as the best mounts.

You could also flip though the Pleistocene flash cards and see of something in the mega fauna department fits the bill.

d-_-b
11-11-2009, 12:57 AM
My war elephant will have a ring of sustenance in it's trunk, a ring of endure elements in it's left ear and wear an enchanted barding of f...... awesomeness. It will be extremely proud of these facts and flaunt it everywhere it goes.

-His name will be Dolph and he likes peanuts

tesral
11-11-2009, 08:54 AM
That is why elephants are cool, they work for peanuts.

d-_-b
11-11-2009, 11:38 AM
Dolph does not consider war to be work. He enjoys killing and does it for free. He does appreciate the odd token of affection, though, as long as it is offered through the proper medium: peanuts.

-THAT's the great thing about this particular elephant;)

Dr.Dead
11-11-2009, 09:49 PM
try advancing the heavy warhorse 5 levels higher from the heavy war horse , and adjust the stats for the war horse from large to huge.

d-_-b
11-12-2009, 04:01 AM
try advancing the heavy warhorse 5 levels higher from the heavy war horse , and adjust the stats for the war horse from large to huge.

If you're going to adjust the size of the heavy warhorse from Large to Huge there is absolutely no need to advance it 5 levels as well. But seriously, a huge horse? There simply is a limit to the size horses grow and while I have surely seen horses in RL that seem huge by comparison to other large horses these impressive creatures are nowhere near the size of an elephant -which is huge.

The ogre can't have a horse. Period. He can have an angry elephant, though. Just not Dolph -he's mine.

tesral
11-12-2009, 05:00 PM
IThere simply is a limit to the size horses grow and while I have surely seen horses in RL that seem huge by comparison to other large horses these impressive creatures are nowhere near the size of an elephant -which is huge.


Right, we are going to impose reality on the size of the mount for an ogre....

cigamnogard
11-12-2009, 05:37 PM
:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:: laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::l augh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

d-_-b
11-12-2009, 06:26 PM
:D hehe. I do see your point. To answer your question: Yes, I would impose reality on the size of a mount for an ogre. I guess one could allow horses, or indeed and sort of creature, to fluctuate in size so everybody could have the one they wanted -a tiny one for Paris' purse and a gargantuan one for an ogre with a minority complex. I'm just not advocating it.
I think it is okay for fantastic creatures to come in all sizes but I think that the mundane ones should stay mundane, even in a highly magical worlds such as Faerun, lest the fantastic too should become mundane.

tesral
11-14-2009, 02:13 AM
For Faerun? Too late

cigamnogard
11-16-2009, 05:19 PM
Have never played in Faerun - is it high magic?

d-_-b
11-17-2009, 05:39 AM
It's close to being as high fantasy/magic as anything gets. I swear they'll have enchanted white porcelain toilets next:)

Personally I actually think I prefer low and gritty fantasy where magic is rare, but I have been GM'ing a Forgotten Realms campaign for some time now, and I think it's a great setting.

tesral
11-17-2009, 08:11 AM
It's close to being as high fantasy/magic as anything gets. I swear they'll have enchanted white porcelain toilets next:)

They don't?

Pushkins
11-17-2009, 02:10 PM
I have a golden +7 toilet of Divine wiping, that only has holy water in it

cigamnogard
11-19-2009, 06:28 PM
Too bad D&D never had a chance to encorporate Chris Bunch's Seer King novels as a world - talk about grit.

tesral
11-20-2009, 06:26 AM
Too bad D&D never had a chance to encorporate Chris Bunch's Seer King novels as a world - talk about grit.

Start Incorporating dude. No one is stopping you. Seriously. They cannot license everything.

cigamnogard
11-26-2009, 07:37 PM
Hmmm...I think that's a great idea!