Tamburlain
06-04-2009, 11:56 AM
Hello, all.
I'd like to get your suggestions, if willing to slog through this lengthy post, as to which rpg system(s) you feel might be best suited for running a campaign based on Robert Holdstock's world presented in his Mythago Cycle (http://www.robertholdstock.com/news.html)of novels and short stories. (More ambitiously, if you feel this is a concept worthy of its own system, do tell, as I've been thinking along those lines, too, but am intimidated by the vagaries of copyright law.) Aside from eventually building an original rpg from scratch, however, my goals presently are more modest and immediate. I just want to find an extant system that will bring this world to life and hopefully find one that can support the hybrid-sandbox setting that I hope to write about on my blog here at PaPG.
If unfamiliar with his work, no worries. I will outline the gist of the setting, as I've devised it so far, which is directly inspired by Holdstock's cannon. Lastly, I'll also note a few of the unique challenges I feel its thematic complexity presents to game-play and development.
1. Setting(s)
The initial game story in the campaign I envision is set in England (East Sussex) in 1971. Within this county there lies an estate established by a lesser Noble in the 16th century, but now is owned by a wealthy Egyptian with a mind to convert the manor house (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/72/Taagepera_castle_2008.jpg) into a luxury hotel. The estate property includes several areas of interest, including a small but dense woodlands (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6e/Shadows_in_Coldfall_wood.jpg) of about 250-260 acres known as Greyholme Woods, named for the estate's Nobility, but also known by regional folk as Little Harmers' Wood.
2. Mythagos and Mythago Woods of Robert Holdstock
The woodland area abutting Greyholme Manor is, in fact, an example of Robert Holdstock's Mythago Wood (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mythago_Wood), an ancient (primeval) woodland (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_woodland) whose "ecology" is more-or-less undisturbed at least since the retreat of the Devensian. (In 1971 there are very few Mythago "sister" woodlands remaining, e.g., Ryhope Wood in Herefordshire, Broceliande in Brittany.)
Aside from being an ancient woodland, a Mythago Wood is special in other ways. Paraphrasing from a wikipedia source: The wood is far, far bigger on the inside than on the outside; once penetrated, the forest grows larger, older, wilder, and more unbearable as one approaches the heart of the wood. The forest is referred in Jungian terms by literary critic John Clute as an "abyssal chthonic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chthonic) resonator", which is a fancy mouthful of words meaning that it conjures and is home to what Holdstock calls myth-images, or mythagos. Mythagos are beings (including animals, monsters, humans, or other "agents") who embody living correspondences to the human mythic imagination. As manifestations within the boundaries of the primeval woodland, Mythagos are dangerously real, but if any of them stray too far from the wood they slowly deteriorate and die.
Note: The word "chthonic" in the above paragraph is used in the true (i.e. original) sense of the word, from the Greek, meaning of the earth--in all of its stink, rot, and fertile glory; though I LOVE CoC, this word has nothing whatsoever to do with the extra-dimensional alien Cthulhu mythos of H.P. Lovecraft.
To paraphrase the wikipedia entry more: Because they are formed from the tropes of human myths, they will vary in appearance and character depending on the collection and culture of memories from which they emerge; for example there may be, over a period, many different forms of the Mistress of Animals, from Artemis to Hekate; or different forms of King Arthur, Robin Hood, Herne the Hunter, etc.--all looking and acting differently, yet all with the same basic functions and all acting within the 'norms' set by their defining myths.
A Mythago Wood can also generate archetypal places and scenes known as Geistzones, which range in scope and complexity. A Geistzone may be populated by mythagos and may represent any endogenous mythical setting, from a small sacred grove to a paleolithic tribal settlement; from ancient bronze-age villages to Roman baths; from castles to battlefields; caravans to Childe Roland's Dark Tower. You get the picture.
3. The Game:
As envisioned, the setting of the game's first campaign will move back-and-forth between the modern world of 1971, where the player characters are confronted with a central mystery to be solved, to the Mythago Wood. The characters will have different abilities depending on where they venture within the game's many landscapes (acquiring special and individualized powers in Mythago Wood that correspond to tropes from Celtic myth and more ancient still; necessarily, the game's adventure will involve a host of antagonists, some mundane some magical, present in both settings, and all related to the central mystery and associated quests that the game will present to the players.
Players will have a wide range of discretion concerning how and where to focus their exploration. Indeed, part of the game will involve the characters finding out "who they are" in relation to the mythic universe in which they may repeatedly find themselves. Therefore, as an rpg, whatever system that is chosen will require a mechanic flexible enough to resolve conflict and advance storyline throughout a wide array of discrete "micro-settings"--from modern and gritty historical to mythic fantasy.
4. Thematic Tone and Genre
As a gaming genre, the modern setting should be gritty but also more or less realistic, involving risks of gun-play, secret societies, and sleuth-style adventuring for the characters. In contrast, the world of Mythago Wood is neither of the "sword and sorcery" genre nor of traditional fantasy, per se, though it will contain many elements of the fantastic, but limited to a brand of mythic supernaturalism. If done correctly, adventuring in the woodlands should feel like entering a mythic underworld that changes the deeper the characters explore and the closer they come to its primeval heart. It should become darker, more dangerous, more dream-like.
***
So, here is what I have:
I am working now on unifying a set of myths that will define the Geistzones and encounters. They are, of course, related to the endogenous mythologies and native history of southern England, but I have also planned a few surprises. It will not be typical Celtic Authuriana. This written part is almost complete, though I have only just begun work on sketching the maps of the sandbox.
I have several story hooks to engage players and hopefully motivate them to explore the modern surroundings (where the mystery of the game begins) and eventually engage the woodland. But it's not going to be scripted. Ideally, I'd like game-flow to fit somewhere in-between true sandbox style and guided play, where players will have many choices in character creation and narrative development.
Here is what I do not have:
A game. As in, an rpg system. (!) I have toyed, though am not satisfied, with the idea of using Burning Wheel or some heavily modified form of nWoD. Neither seems perfectly suited. I dunno. And that's why I am here writing this--to come about any and all suggestions for how to make this game (and setting) a reality.
I'd like to get your suggestions, if willing to slog through this lengthy post, as to which rpg system(s) you feel might be best suited for running a campaign based on Robert Holdstock's world presented in his Mythago Cycle (http://www.robertholdstock.com/news.html)of novels and short stories. (More ambitiously, if you feel this is a concept worthy of its own system, do tell, as I've been thinking along those lines, too, but am intimidated by the vagaries of copyright law.) Aside from eventually building an original rpg from scratch, however, my goals presently are more modest and immediate. I just want to find an extant system that will bring this world to life and hopefully find one that can support the hybrid-sandbox setting that I hope to write about on my blog here at PaPG.
If unfamiliar with his work, no worries. I will outline the gist of the setting, as I've devised it so far, which is directly inspired by Holdstock's cannon. Lastly, I'll also note a few of the unique challenges I feel its thematic complexity presents to game-play and development.
1. Setting(s)
The initial game story in the campaign I envision is set in England (East Sussex) in 1971. Within this county there lies an estate established by a lesser Noble in the 16th century, but now is owned by a wealthy Egyptian with a mind to convert the manor house (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/72/Taagepera_castle_2008.jpg) into a luxury hotel. The estate property includes several areas of interest, including a small but dense woodlands (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6e/Shadows_in_Coldfall_wood.jpg) of about 250-260 acres known as Greyholme Woods, named for the estate's Nobility, but also known by regional folk as Little Harmers' Wood.
2. Mythagos and Mythago Woods of Robert Holdstock
The woodland area abutting Greyholme Manor is, in fact, an example of Robert Holdstock's Mythago Wood (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mythago_Wood), an ancient (primeval) woodland (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_woodland) whose "ecology" is more-or-less undisturbed at least since the retreat of the Devensian. (In 1971 there are very few Mythago "sister" woodlands remaining, e.g., Ryhope Wood in Herefordshire, Broceliande in Brittany.)
Aside from being an ancient woodland, a Mythago Wood is special in other ways. Paraphrasing from a wikipedia source: The wood is far, far bigger on the inside than on the outside; once penetrated, the forest grows larger, older, wilder, and more unbearable as one approaches the heart of the wood. The forest is referred in Jungian terms by literary critic John Clute as an "abyssal chthonic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chthonic) resonator", which is a fancy mouthful of words meaning that it conjures and is home to what Holdstock calls myth-images, or mythagos. Mythagos are beings (including animals, monsters, humans, or other "agents") who embody living correspondences to the human mythic imagination. As manifestations within the boundaries of the primeval woodland, Mythagos are dangerously real, but if any of them stray too far from the wood they slowly deteriorate and die.
Note: The word "chthonic" in the above paragraph is used in the true (i.e. original) sense of the word, from the Greek, meaning of the earth--in all of its stink, rot, and fertile glory; though I LOVE CoC, this word has nothing whatsoever to do with the extra-dimensional alien Cthulhu mythos of H.P. Lovecraft.
To paraphrase the wikipedia entry more: Because they are formed from the tropes of human myths, they will vary in appearance and character depending on the collection and culture of memories from which they emerge; for example there may be, over a period, many different forms of the Mistress of Animals, from Artemis to Hekate; or different forms of King Arthur, Robin Hood, Herne the Hunter, etc.--all looking and acting differently, yet all with the same basic functions and all acting within the 'norms' set by their defining myths.
A Mythago Wood can also generate archetypal places and scenes known as Geistzones, which range in scope and complexity. A Geistzone may be populated by mythagos and may represent any endogenous mythical setting, from a small sacred grove to a paleolithic tribal settlement; from ancient bronze-age villages to Roman baths; from castles to battlefields; caravans to Childe Roland's Dark Tower. You get the picture.
3. The Game:
As envisioned, the setting of the game's first campaign will move back-and-forth between the modern world of 1971, where the player characters are confronted with a central mystery to be solved, to the Mythago Wood. The characters will have different abilities depending on where they venture within the game's many landscapes (acquiring special and individualized powers in Mythago Wood that correspond to tropes from Celtic myth and more ancient still; necessarily, the game's adventure will involve a host of antagonists, some mundane some magical, present in both settings, and all related to the central mystery and associated quests that the game will present to the players.
Players will have a wide range of discretion concerning how and where to focus their exploration. Indeed, part of the game will involve the characters finding out "who they are" in relation to the mythic universe in which they may repeatedly find themselves. Therefore, as an rpg, whatever system that is chosen will require a mechanic flexible enough to resolve conflict and advance storyline throughout a wide array of discrete "micro-settings"--from modern and gritty historical to mythic fantasy.
4. Thematic Tone and Genre
As a gaming genre, the modern setting should be gritty but also more or less realistic, involving risks of gun-play, secret societies, and sleuth-style adventuring for the characters. In contrast, the world of Mythago Wood is neither of the "sword and sorcery" genre nor of traditional fantasy, per se, though it will contain many elements of the fantastic, but limited to a brand of mythic supernaturalism. If done correctly, adventuring in the woodlands should feel like entering a mythic underworld that changes the deeper the characters explore and the closer they come to its primeval heart. It should become darker, more dangerous, more dream-like.
***
So, here is what I have:
I am working now on unifying a set of myths that will define the Geistzones and encounters. They are, of course, related to the endogenous mythologies and native history of southern England, but I have also planned a few surprises. It will not be typical Celtic Authuriana. This written part is almost complete, though I have only just begun work on sketching the maps of the sandbox.
I have several story hooks to engage players and hopefully motivate them to explore the modern surroundings (where the mystery of the game begins) and eventually engage the woodland. But it's not going to be scripted. Ideally, I'd like game-flow to fit somewhere in-between true sandbox style and guided play, where players will have many choices in character creation and narrative development.
Here is what I do not have:
A game. As in, an rpg system. (!) I have toyed, though am not satisfied, with the idea of using Burning Wheel or some heavily modified form of nWoD. Neither seems perfectly suited. I dunno. And that's why I am here writing this--to come about any and all suggestions for how to make this game (and setting) a reality.